How to use a hide

[DrNickBurton]

I'm looking to buy a hide. From reading some older threads, I see that a lot of the members here already use hides. I'm interested to hear how they set them up.

In particular, it seems to me that it would not generally be possible to just rack up and plant a hide in a good looking spot (i.e. typically this would be on private land). How do you handle this issue? Do you seek permission from the land owner? In your experiance, how easy is it to get permission? (I would imagine that it is not!)

[PMG]

The answer is it all depends where but on private land you would be wise to ask for permission first ........ showing an album of photos you already have may just sway the issue esp if you're prepared to give a couple of prints to the landowner of 'his birds' on his land or whatever!

The easier option is a bag hide or just all over camo clothing which means you can sit/lie down where you want for a spell and just sort of 'disappear' it also means you can get up and run off if someone bothers you - well you might be able to run off - I'd have to stand and fight or at least argue or inveigle or disemble as my running days are over!

It all depends on what the species is, where you are, how safe is it, is it legal, is it at a nest site and do you need a licence to photograph that particular species and so on - the list of variables is endless - but a lot of times it would be poss to pop up a hide and jump in esp if there was two of you taking turns and therefore someone to 'watch your back' so to speak.

I've used a selection of hides, bivvy bags, bag hides, throw over scrim in numerous situations including wader nests in the Outer Hebrides - things like ringed plover and oystercatcher with the usual proviso - if the bird hasn't returned to its nest within 15 mins you get out take it down and leave pronto: some birds will not accept a hide and some are tucking down on the nest before you've finished setting up ....... its horses for courses but always worth throwing a pop-up up and trying for 15 mins - they are so easy these days to take up and down. Good hunting!

[Jonners]

Something that has often made me wonder about using a hide... I once heard that crows (or maybe pigeons) can only count up to (I think) 2. The logic behind this was that if a person entered a hide in a field the birds would not return until he had gone. If two people entered hide and one left, birds would not return until the other had left. But if 3 entered hide and two left, birds would return, probably to be filled with small particles of lead! Has anyone any experience as to how tru this is? Perhaps it's more relvant to those birds under peril of life, but it has made me think that perhaps if I was to come along and then hide or scrim, I might have already blown my cover.

[davecatt]

It applies to all wild life I first used a hide in the mid sixtys (A home made affair using bamboo canes and hesion backed with black out material).

In those day it was standard practice to take someone along and once the hide was up and the user conceild the second man left the area.

Essential if watching nest sites. It definiteley works the wild life settle down much sooner when they see the intruder leaving. Its also important if you follow this practice to have your acomplice return so that you can leave together.
Dave

[PMG]

Yes my early experiences were exactly as Davecatts I did a bit of nest photography this way in the '70's particularly at nests - the hide was moved in closer over a number of days making sure from a distance after that the bird had returned to its nest. Nest photography has gone 'out of fashion' in recent years as regards taking images actually at the nest and young - but its very possible to watch a chosen area - watch where a bird is perching regularly and put a hide up impromtu at that spot and chance your arm - the bird either accepts and continues with its pattern of behaviour - or it avoids that perch and you give in and go and have a rethink!!! Sometimes putting the hide up in darkness, getting and settling in for a few hours can work too - but as with all things its hit and miss!

PS And yes we did used to work in 'twos' one person put in the hide by the other and one leave - and you didn't come back out till the prearranged time the other person came back for you and you and the hide left together .......

[DrNickBurton]

My question really is how do you handle the issue of putting a hide on private land. I can't really think that there are many places in the UK at all that are not privately owned (farmland, a wildlife trust, national trust, RSPB etc. etc.), so if you do use a hide, I assume you end up making a lot of phone calls? What are your experiances of gaining permission?

[eeyore]

Originally Posted by DrNickBurton

My question really is how do you handle the issue of putting a hide on private land. I can't really think that there are many places in the UK at all that are not privately owned (farmland, a wildlife trust, national trust, RSPB etc. etc.), so if you do use a hide, I assume you end up making a lot of phone calls? What are your experiances of gaining permission?

In my experience you can pretty much forget it on most nature reserves not only because they get loads of such requests but also because these sites are open to the public and thus it isnt feasible/sensible to leave a hide in position for a long time (there is also the issue of precedent for the site manager who has to consider that if he grants your request how will he justify refusal in the future) - That said it is sometimes possible , particularly with small sites/organisations to negotiate a pics for access deal

However on private land ie farmland / private woodlands it can be a gooer - the key is to make things as easy as possible for the farmer/keeper assure him that you wont get in the way and respect his property/livestock/ access limitations etc.

I would generally write in the first instance , enclosing a couple of the sorts of pics I want to take, and outlining what permision I need, including the assurance that i will leave his land as i found it when i leave, and that i will be happy to give him both a couple of prints and a cd of images for his use if he wants ( i have also in the past done other photography for the landowner as part of the deal such as shots of his livestock for display in his farm shop). I then follow this up with a phone call after a reasonable period and if he is happy to do so a meeting in person.

In my experience most landowners are happy to give permision once they understand that you wont cause any hassle for them ( though you do get the occasional one who just gives a flat no). I would suggest that rather than a shotgun approach of making loads of calls it is better to research personal contacts and aquaintances and such - people who drink in your local and what have you. ((even patients assuming you are that kind of doctor) If you are succesful then maintain the relationship both through keeping your word on not being a nuisance and also through staying in touch sending xmas card etc

once you have one happy landowner it becomes easier as you can get them to commend you to others.

[snake]

Hi Dr Nick,
Sound advice from Eeyore but bear in mind the numerous requests that a farmer can get for access to his land. I have a lot of farmer friends who are constantly being asked things like, can I walk my dog, go metal detecting, shoot pigeons, ferret Rabbits, pick mushrooms, go jogging, "take photographs" are just a few I can think of.
They also have problems with members of the public fly tipping in their gateways, leaving litter on the fields, leaving gates open ect.
These things cost them time and money and do not help with their attitude towards the general public.
The larger the farm the more requests they have. Many of them find it easier to say no to everyone rather than have constant disturbance on the farm especially if it is used for sporting purposes.
My advice would be to approach a smaller farmer in the way eeyore suggests, don't ask for access to the whole farm, maybe just to set up the hide in a corner of a wood next to the road to start. Show him your work and offer to give him some prints, gain his confidence. Farmers are mostly a very nice easy going type with a love of the countryside and would like to have photos of wildlife from their farm.
Don't be put off if you get initial refusals, you will eventually find somewhere.
When you do a bottle of scotch at Christmas goes a long way.

[DrNickBurton]

Thanks guys, that's good advice. As it happens we know a farmer in the west country. They need someone to photograph their B&B accomodation for a website....