New Lens

[BillyPilgrim]

Originally Posted by HowlinWolf

I think that is getting into the realms of smuggling (rather you than me). Loophole, or not, the lens has not been imported into the UK by Sigma, and they frown upon such business practices.
On a similar vein, Nikon, for example, will not touch a grey import lens that may need repairs, warranty or otherwise, even if you offer to pay for their services. You would have to seek out a third party service establishment, that may not have access to genuine Nikon parts, or their staff trained in dealing with such lenses.

HW

It is non of Sigma's or Nikon's business how the lens arrives in the UK. Once it has been purchased from them - wherever that purchase make take place -end of story. Tax issues are the business of the proper authorities. If they find something wrong they will take it up with the importer of the goods, not the company who manufactured them. So why would Sigma or Nikon be concerned. Unless, perish the thought, they are trying to charge us Brits more than they charge Johnny foreigner

Thank goodness Canon don't do this. I recently spent several thousand pounds (but saved several hundred) on one of their lenses which was direct import, ie. not imported by them. It was faulty and I received a replacement. After a few months the replacement developed a fault (actually it was on the lens hood) and on production of the invoice they supplied a new part free of charge.

[HowlinWolf]

Originally Posted by BillyPilgrim

It is non of Sigma's or Nikon's business how the lens arrives in the UK.

It is in every way the business of Nikon or Sigma on how the lens arrives for the UK market. These manufactures (amongst others) choose and use approved importers for their equipment. These firms will support the user and their equipment in every way, including warranty repairs for a designated period.
Using sellected UK importers ensures that goods are handled responsibly, where as grey imports have possibly changed hands many times before arriving here, and may have been stored in less-than-ideal conditions, giving rise to problems as the equipment ages. Some samples have been identified as refurbished items sold as new.
The major manufacturers are trying to protect their reputation and give the public the best it can expect from the goods they make. Grey importers, on the other hand, offer no help lines, or are equipped with workshops employing knowledgeable staff. Should a purchase go missing during transportation, and assuming the buyer has been prudent enough to take out insurance cover, the tracing and tracking of the item is left up to the buyer. Once the seller has received payment they will show no further interest in the matter.

As for avoiding paying the relevant taxes on imported goods: beware. If the Customs declaration form is deemed to be misleading the buyer can be subject to financial penalties or prosecution, and may have to forfeit goods. Customs can, and do, hold packages with declarations that are intended to deceive, and charge so accordingly. Of course, if the vendor reimburses you to the full amount of import duties and VAT at 17.5% then all is well. It is becoming common to think cheap means value for money, especially with the advent of the internet and on-line auction sites, but this is not always the case, despite prices initially seeming attractive. You may be lucky and have no further issues with equipment that need warranty work, but it seems to me that people who buy via this route are always reporting failures of this and that in higher proportion to those that buy from official sources, and the need to return various items from whence they came.

It's up to you.

HW

[BillyPilgrim]

Originally Posted by HowlinWolf

Using sellected UK importers ensures that goods are handled responsibly, where as grey imports have possibly changed hands many times before arriving here, and may have been stored in less-than-ideal conditions, giving rise to problems as the equipment ages. Some samples have been identified as refurbished items sold as new.
The major manufacturers are trying to protect their reputation and give the public the best it can expect from the goods they make. Grey importers, on the other hand, offer no help lines, or are equipped with workshops employing knowledgeable staff. Should a purchase go missing during transportation, and assuming the buyer has been prudent enough to take out insurance cover, the tracing and tracking of the item is left up to the buyer. Once the seller has received payment they will show no further interest in the matter.

HW

All pure conjecture on your part whereas I speak from personal experience.

My seller ordered a brand new replacement lens for me. When I collected it he gave me £40 cash to cover my petrol costs. I checked the date of manufacture and lens was about 1 month old. Doesn't really fit with your take on things does it?

There are many thousands of people who have had similar positive experiences when buying from direct import companies.

There are many members of this site who have received excellent goods and service from these companies. Quite why anyone would want to rubbish this with unsubstantiated claims is simply baffling.

[Steve S]

At the risk of sticking my head up and getting it shot off, I agree in essence with what HowlinWolf says. Anyone taking part in a transaction that deliberately avoids paying the due import taxes etc. may think that they are simply saving a stash of cash, but have in fact crossed the line into smuggling.

Some vendors do sell lenses etc. at competitive prices and have paid the import duty. If you are looking to save some money then they are the vendors I would recommend dealing with.

As for the supply chain: It costs to maintain a good storage, distribution and repair service. This is all costed in to the regional market prices. An item bought in a region where such costs are lower, (and obviously at a lower price) and then self-distributed, (and possibly smuggled) to higher cost areas at a profit is not contributing to the maintenance of the official supply/repair network. If that was being done to something that I was manufacturing and selling, and then being asked to repair for free, I’d think twice about how willing I would be to fix it.

Steve.

[Chris Hammond]

All of the shots in my gallery were taken on a Sigma 50 - 500MM APO. I've been very happy with it so far, but I'm surprised to hear others are using it without a tripod. I find it too slow for that in most cases, though it's almost certain that the shortcoming is mine and not the lens'.

I've only recently realised that this lens is what others call a 'Bigma'.

[Digifrog]

So with all that said, I have 2 questions.

1. Are Onestop Digital a grey market retailer?

2. Are Onestop Digital and the courier FedEx therefore responsible for smuggling imported items into the UK? Or does that responsibility lie with the buyer?

I don't think either company will endorse this behaviour, especially the courier.

I am expecting FedEx to ask me for the import duty when my lens arrives. If they do I might pay it & I will get a reciept, and then I have 2 options.

a. Keep the reciept and keep my UK warranty with Sigma UK.

or

b. Send the reciept to the retailer and get the cost of import duty refunded by them.

I don't know what to expect to be honest. This is the first time I've ever bought something through this way. I've read the Terms & Conditions from both parties (taking care to note the legal wording) and am still unclear.

Still waiting for a reply from Sigma UK regarding the matter.

Incidentally, what happens if I need my lens repaired after say 4 years, when the warranty has ran out? Who would I contact?

Scptt

[BillyPilgrim]

Originally Posted by Digifrog

b. Send the reciept to the retailer and get the cost of import duty refunded by them.

Can't you send them a copy or scanned image? Then you'd have the proof of VAT payment and all should be ok with the warranty. I think this is how it works with Digital Rev.

[Digifrog]

Originally Posted by BillyPilgrim

Can't you send them a copy or scanned image? Then you'd have the proof of VAT payment and all should be ok with the warranty. I think this is how it works with Digital Rev.

Yeah the DVLA do that, you keep the original & send a copy. I think they (OSD) ask for the original reciept. It would be good if they accepted a copy. that way I'd get the vat refunded + a sigma uk wrranty.

One of my previous quotes was, "You only get what you pay for." Which seems to be quite apt in this situation. Pay £770 for the lens from a UK reatiler and get a full Sigma UK 3 year warranty, or; Pay £570 for the lens from OSD and get a 1 year warranty to be sent abroad for repair, and possibly stung for vat & duty (which if that happens OSD will refund).

Choices choices. Pay the £570 and hope nothing goes wrong with it?

I'll reiterate my previous point of, what would I do if I need the lens repaired after the warranty expires?

Scott

[Steve S]

Originally Posted by Digifrog

I'll reiterate my previous point of, what would I do if I need the lens repaired after the warranty expires?

You do what anyone else would do; trawl the internet/yellow pages and find a camera repair specialist that can work on your lens. Ideally someone who is Sigma trained, someone who is Sigma approved would be even better, Sigma themselves would be best of all. Then comes the painful bit - you pay.

Steve.

[HowlinWolf]

Originally Posted by BillyPilgrim

All pure conjecture on your part whereas I speak from personal experience.

My seller ordered a brand new replacement lens for me. When I collected it he gave me £40 cash to cover my petrol costs. I checked the date of manufacture and lens was about 1 month old. Doesn't really fit with your take on things does it?

There are many thousands of people who have had similar positive experiences when buying from direct import companies.

There are many members of this site who have received excellent goods and service from these companies. Quite why anyone would want to rubbish this with unsubstantiated claims is simply baffling.

Like I said: It's up to you.

HW

[Digifrog]

Originally Posted by Steve S

You do what anyone else would do; trawl the internet/yellow pages and find a camera repair specialist that can work on your lens. Ideally someone who is Sigma trained, someone who is Sigma approved would be even better, Sigma themselves would be best of all. Then comes the painful bit - you pay.

Steve.

Hi Steve

Thanks for the tip. Well if it ever needs repairing, I hope it will be after very good use, i.e. several years. That way I'd be happy to pay Sigma themselves to do it. That is if they would still repair an import. I think I would probably insure the lens for failure at some point too.

[NickCantle]

That's my situation Scott... I think you've just got to take the plunge sometimes and hope nothing goes wrong. I mean I'd probably pay Sigma for repair should I need it, and we mustn't forget that we've (I bought for a similar price) both saved a couple of hundred pounds anyway. I just wish you the best of luck, not that you should need it I hope.

Look forward to receiving it Scott, it's a great lens mate.

Nick

[Digifrog]

Originally Posted by NickCantle

That's my situation Scott... I think you've just got to take the plunge sometimes and hope nothing goes wrong. I mean I'd probably pay Sigma for repair should I need it, and we mustn't forget that we've (I bought for a similar price) both saved a couple of hundred pounds anyway. I just wish you the best of luck, not that you should need it I hope.

Look forward to receiving it Scott, it's a great lens mate.

Nick

Thanks Nick

I wish you the same luck I wish myself. Hope to get many good years use without any gremlins.

The lens arrived today. I had a very quick look (whilst on my dinner break) and it seems to be fine. The only problem is my cheap tripod. The lens fits onto my tripod mount backwards because the tripod mount won't attach in the normal position due to a raised part on the lens bracket. And even if I just click on the shutter release there is a wobble. Cheap tripod?

I use a D80 and I'm wondering if there is a remote shutter release I can use? Like with my old film SLR? In that way you do not need to touch the camera.

I have the ML-13 Remote Control, but I haven't fully worked that out yet. You can only use the ML-13 in Manual and only when the [' '] setting is shown?

I want to be able to remotely shoot whilst in A or P mode, or even in Auto.

Scott

[glsammy]

Originally Posted by Digifrog

I'll reiterate my previous point of, what would I do if I need the lens repaired after the warranty expires?

Scott

We've already covered this Scott, you buy a Mack warranty! Simple and cheap, problem solved for a further 3 years.

[Digifrog]

Originally Posted by glsammy

We've already covered this Scott, you buy a Mack warranty! Simple and cheap, problem solved for a further 3 years.

Thank Graham.

I think I've got the idea with Mack. I do mean to reply your email btw, I'm just so busy at this end at the moment.

Being new to owning rather expensive equipment I just want to be clear what to do if anything goes wrong. I'm not going to worry about it for the first 11 moths because of my warranty, but after that.

With Mack, where would I send the item. As was mentioned previously, I would prefer Sigma themselves to do any repair, or a competent Sigma specialist. Would Sigma still touch an imported lens that wasn't imported by Sigma (even outside of manufacturers warranty)?

Apologies for throwing so many questions. But I'm a worrier at heart I'll try not to worry too much now, but I will worry this time next year, by which time I hope to more educated in the matter. Right now I've got a new lens and I want to have fun.

Scott

[glsammy]

Originally Posted by Digifrog

Thank Graham.

I think I've got the idea with Mack. I do mean to reply your email btw, I'm just so busy at this end at the moment.

Being new to owning rather expensive equipment I just want to be clear what to do if anything goes wrong. I'm not going to worry about it for the first 11 moths because of my warranty, but after that.

With Mack, where would I send the item. As was mentioned previously, I would prefer Sigma themselves to do any repair, or a competent Sigma specialist. Would Sigma still touch an imported lens that wasn't imported by Sigma (even outside of manufacturers warranty)?

Apologies for throwing so many questions. But I'm a worrier at heart I'll try not to worry too much now, but I will worry this time next year, by which time I hope to more educated in the matter. Right now I've got a new lens and I want to have fun.

Scott

There's no problem having Sigma repair the lens with your Mack warranty. I started a Mack claim when my zoom broke. You contact them and they give you a repair reference number and they ask you to get a quote for repair.
Of course, being a Sigma lens, and they have a repair centre in the UK, you contact Sigma for this. I did this, and at this point I stopped my Mack claim as Sigma offered to do the repair FOC, even though it was out of the warranty period.
Once you have your quote, Mack will authorize the repair and cover the cost.