Wildife artist looking for Wildlife photography advice

[mhc-art]

Good afternoon all,

I'm hoping you can help advise me on a camera and lense for wildlife photography. I am starting out as a wildlife artist and will be going to Africa next year for a month where my main objective is to collect as much reference material as possible.

I am looking at either the Canon 400D or the 30D, am I right in thinking the 400D is the entry level camera and the 30D a step up?... I am quite sure that it will be either of those cameras I choose, what I am less sure of is what zoom lense I should go for as I have no idea what to look for. Any advice would be very much appreciated, how much can I expect to pay?, will I also need another lense for closer subjects or is there one that does both?.. do I buy the camera body only?, any good websites you may all be able to direct me to would also be helpful?..

Thanks!

Martin

[Brocker]

Hi Martin,

Firstly, which camera to buy. I have copied and pasted a recent review which will give a little guidance.
'In conclusion, I am thrilled to have upgraded to a 30D, and I cannot recommend the 30D enough over the 400D, especially for adventurous shooters who like to tackle all sorts of subjects. If you are one who takes your photography seriously, you will outgrow the 400D in no time, as I did with my old 300D; in this regard, the 30D makes for a better investment that just might last you long enough till you move up into the realms of full-frame bodies and L-series lenses. In time, when you are faced with challenging shooting conditions, you’d be glad you chose the 30D, because it is then you will realize you’ll get your shot by how fast you can adjust the controls on your camera and not by having an extra 2 million pixels.'
On the question of which zoom, there are a few threads on WAB which discuss this. My preference for a zoom is the Canon 100-400mm IS USM lens which is superb. For this, you are looking at between £700 and £1000 depending on your luck. The next issue is close up photography. Are you looking at close as in 4 feet or close as in macro which is minute close, such as insects etc? As for websites, there are many. Try Canons' own website and also various specialist camera sites like Warehouse Express or Camera King. . . Hope this helps a little.

[JeffH]

Hi Martin

Welcome to WAB

I don't wish to appear unhelpful but similar questions have been raised many times before and instead of having all the same advice repeated again I'd suggest you start by using the site's search facility and perhaps try under 'which camera' and 'which lens'. This should lead you to numerous helpful threads, though you'll find much conflicting advice depending on whether the poster is a user of Canon, Nikon or another brand

Jeff

[naturelover]

hi martin welcome to the site,you will find quite a few artists on this site,me being one enjoy the site.

[RichBrew]

Jeff's right about choosing a camera. Since you're starting from scratch your best bet is to go to a camera shop (by that I mean a real camera shop) and actually handle the equipment within your budget. You will find that certain models will feel better in your hands, or that buttons to access menus etc are more easy/difficult to operate. Choose what suits you, not what you've read somewhere. Canon and Nikon are as good as each other. If either was no good, the other would have gone out of business a long time ago. Whichever way you go, remember that the camera is just a tool to get the images you want. As an artist, you will know that no-one will ask what brushes you used to create a picture: the same should apply to cameras, though often that is not the case.

RichBrew

[mhc-art]

Thanks for all the help!

Brocker, useful stuff, I think I will go for the 30D, I have handled both and altthough tempted by the extra 2m pixels the 30D feels a better quality and more robust camera. I'm a little surprised the zoom lens is going to cost me as much as the camera!!... that pushes it way out of my budget, but I to a degree my paintings will only be as good as the reference so I might have to.

Jeff/Rich I have been doing my own research in camera shops and looked up posts on this website that may be appropriate. I guess I just wanted the most recent advice and to personalise it a little by explaining my circumstances, although I guess things don't change too quickly in photography.

Cheers everyone!

[Brocker]

Martin,
The Canon 400mm is one of the top of the range lenses. You can come down a little in price by grabbing a 300mm lens and change the brand to a Sigma or Tamron. These will give great quality images but are historically cheaper in price. A lot of the professional on-line retailers offer good advice and you can give them a call and talk to them personally or better still go into their shops. . Good luck and let us know how you get on

[paulthomas]

Originally Posted by mhc-art

Good afternoon all,

I'm hoping you can help advise me on a camera and lense for wildlife photography. I am starting out as a wildlife artist and will be going to Africa next year for a month where my main objective is to collect as much reference material as possible.

I am looking at either the Canon 400D or the 30D, am I right in thinking the 400D is the entry level camera and the 30D a step up?... I am quite sure that it will be either of those cameras I choose, what I am less sure of is what zoom lense I should go for as I have no idea what to look for. Any advice would be very much appreciated, how much can I expect to pay?, will I also need another lense for closer subjects or is there one that does both?.. do I buy the camera body only?, any good websites you may all be able to direct me to would also be helpful?..

Thanks!

Martin

Africa can be a very hostile place to take a camera. I won't advise you what to buy or not buy but I will say don't expect consumer grade cameras and lenses to survive a month's exposure to the African dust.

[HowlinWolf]

You make a good point here, Paul. I don't know if mhc-art is intending to shoot game, but game drives in national parks are very hard on camera equipment, and there is the possibility that dust would present a major problem.

I've added a link to some safari shooting tips. I hope it helps him make a more informed decision.

HW

Digital Safari Equipment Tips

[eeyore]

Originally Posted by HowlinWolf

You make a good point here, Paul. I don't know if mhc-art is intending to shoot game, but game drives in national parks are very hard on camera equipment, and there is the possibility that dust would present a major problem.

I've added a link to some safari shooting tips. I hope it helps him make a more informed decision.

HW

Digital Safari Equipment Tips

Id definitely agree with that - i've no safaried but shooting anything from a moving vehicle in a dusty environment is hard on your gear.

on the camera front ( I can only advise on canon - but nikon have equally good gear)unless you can afford pro spec gear I'd tend to go with the new 40D which has the better build of the 30D family but also features the active dust removal of the 400D. - you might also want to get a 400D or secondhand 20D/30D/350D etc as a backup body.

Shooting from a moving vehicle with limited space I would definitely sugest you get an image stabilised lens - and also one with a good zoom range cos you dont want to be changing lenses willy nilly.

on canon this will mean either the canon 100-400 IS , or the sigma 80-400 OS . If you chose nikon you have a chioice of the nikon 80-400 VR , or the sigma.

If your budget wont stretch to these you could go with something like the 70-300 IS but i would tend towards 400 rather than 300mm if you can stretch to it.

Whatever lens you buy stick a high quality UV filter on the front to protect the optics from grit , and also invest in a decent sensor and lens cleaning kit to use each night.

Also make sure you have plenty of memory cards , and batteries as I guess you wont be able to download or recharge until the evening. Both of these can be bopught cheaply from outlets like 7 day shop.

And finally get a decent quality camera bag to take your kit and protect it when not being used - plus possibly a waistcoat or belt kit to take your cards etc as you need to lay hands on them quickly.

Also if you want to gen up on the camera and using it in the field I'd reccomend the "wildlife photographers year" and "Digital SLR handbook" both by Andy Rouse

hope all that helps

[mhc-art]

Great info guys, thanks!..

Taking into account that you say 'don't expect consumer grade cameras and lenses to survive a month's exposure to the African dust' what kind of budget is realistic for the camera and lense?... 30D is about £700, will a £300 Sigma or Tamron lens do the job or are we talking £700-1000 price range for a more reliable lens?

I am planning on being in Africa for one month photographing a variety of wildlife from a car/hide etc, I realise it could be hard going for a camera but I presume these cameras are robust enough to cope as long as they are looked after, or am I wrong?

Thanks for the link Howlinwolf, it's a really good read!.. though if I go to the expense he advises I will not be able to get to Africa!

[paulthomas]

Originally Posted by mhc-art

Great info guys, thanks!..

Taking into account that you say 'don't expect consumer grade cameras and lenses to survive a month's exposure to the African dust' what kind of budget is realistic for the camera and lense?... 30D is about £700, will a £300 Sigma or Tamron lens do the job or are we talking £700-1000 price range for a more reliable lens?

I am planning on being in Africa for one month photographing a variety of wildlife from a car/hide etc, I realise it could be hard going for a camera but I presume these cameras are robust enough to cope as long as they are looked after, or am I wrong?

Sorry but everything you have listed so far is consumer grade. The only Canon bodies which are fully sealed are the 1D series. Some Canon lenses such as the 500/f4 are sealed (that's a very popular lens for wildlife photography). None of the Sigma lenses are sealed. No idea about Tamron . Most people I know who have been to Africa have taken at least two camera bodies. This not only gives you a backup body (even pro gear can fail!) but you can go out with the telephoto on one body and a wide-angle on the other so avoiding lens changes. From some of the photos I've seen I can guarantee you will want to take landscapes as well as wildlife

[eeyore]

Originally Posted by mhc-art

Great info guys, thanks!..

Taking into account that you say 'don't expect consumer grade cameras and lenses to survive a month's exposure to the African dust' what kind of budget is realistic for the camera and lense?... 30D is about ?700, will a ?300 Sigma or Tamron lens do the job or are we talking ?700-1000 price range for a more reliable lens?

I am planning on being in Africa for one month photographing a variety of wildlife from a car/hide etc, I realise it could be hard going for a camera but I presume these cameras are robust enough to cope as long as they are looked after, or am I wrong?

Thanks for the link Howlinwolf, it's a really good read!.. though if I go to the expense he advises I will not be able to get to Africa!

Pro gear is probably out of your price range - the 1Dmk3 is circa £3K body only , the 1DS Mk3 in the region of £4.5k , while the 500mm f4.5 is in the region of £4k - unless you can afford to invest arround 10k in this trip I suggest you forget the proffesional gear option.

Numerous people take consumer level gear to africa without a problem , but yes you do need to look after it - ie by putting filters on your lenses , not changing lenses unless you have to - putting anti dust covers on body and camera , regularly cleaning your camera , lenses and bag etc.

As to which model to take either should be okay tho the 400D is entry level and thus has a lesser build quality than the 30D/40D. - depending on how much money you have I would suggest you get two high end consumer bodies (such as one 40D and one 30D) and two high end consumer lenses one long and one wide ( e.g the 100-400 Is and the 28-135 IS) and leave one on each body negating the need to change lenses in dusty conditions. (total cost arround 2.5k) If you cant afford that look to get one body second hand and forego the IS on the shorter lens

both should withstand a month just beaware that as they are not pro level weather sealed cameras a certain ammount of dust will get in however careful you are meaning that you will have to do some post processing in photoshop (which everyone does even pros) and also that your gear will need to go away for a clean and service on your return.

[zan]

One thing you don't mention is how serious you are about your photography. If you only want reference material, you might be better off renting a high-end setup for the duration of your trip. Spend your money on loads of memory cards and a portable hard-disk for downloading 'on the move' so you can come back with the pictures you want.

I don't know how much experience you have with photography either, but getting some practice in before you go will really help. I spend a lot of time shooting seagulls to practice my actions shots and panning, and will help you get used to the gear you'll be using.

finally, I would suggest that the most important part of your setup will be the lens you put on it. If I was going to choose, I'd go with a cheaper body and get a couple of nice lenses. I've been using a 400d for a year and a half and it's a cracking camera (although some people do find it too small for their hands). Have a look at Wild Ocean Photography - Wildlife and coastal images of Scotland by Rosanna Milligan for some examples of my shots (or do a search in here).

Hope this is some help, and have an amazing time in Africa!

Zan

PS putting a transparent shower cap over your camera and taping it to your lens is an easy and very very cheap way of weather-sealing your camera.

[mhc-art]

I think I'm going to have to stick to the consumer grade camere/lens, pro stuff is way out of my budget.

The photographs I take will be for reference so I don't think they need to be professional. With a 400D or 30D and two lenses (100-400 Is and the 28-135 Is) I should get results that I'm happy with and can use for my paintings. I will also probably only stick with one camera and hope for no problems, unless I can get a second hand 400D for a good price.

I have thought about hiring a camera for the month in Africa but like any skill I don't expect photography to be straight forward and I need to get to grips with the camera with a few months practice. I also think hiring is pretty expensive, unless anyone knows any good places?... I may still hire a lense if buying two proves too expensive.

Thanks everyone for all the tips and links!

[eeyore]

Originally Posted by mhc-art

I think I'm going to have to stick to the consumer grade camere/lens, pro stuff is way out of my budget.

The photographs I take will be for reference so I don't think they need to be professional. With a 400D or 30D and two lenses (100-400 Is and the 28-135 Is) I should get results that I'm happy with and can use for my paintings. I will also probably only stick with one camera and hope for no problems, unless I can get a second hand 400D for a good price.

I have thought about hiring a camera for the month in Africa but like any skill I don't expect photography to be straight forward and I need to get to grips with the camera with a few months practice. I also think hiring is pretty expensive, unless anyone knows any good places?... I may still hire a lense if buying two proves too expensive.

Thanks everyone for all the tips and links!

i generally hire gear from calumet if i need something specific - but they arent what could be called cheap and for a month its almost certainly not economic unless you have your own business and can put it against tax.

one idea for back up could be to get a bridge camera like the panasonic FZ50 or FZ8 this has a fixed lens which generally equates to arround 35- 350mm (35mm equivalent) - probably not good enough for your main gear but better than nowt if your principal body breaks - the FZ8 is about 200 notes while the 50 is arround 300. whatever you do i certainly would go to africa for a month without some kind of back up - imagine what would happen if your only camera broke , got damaged, or stolen in week 1

[STEinGUZZ]

Hi mhc-art,

Allthough I am new to Photography, infact i've only just purchased my Canon 40D, I have been interested and wanting to buy for a while. I spent months trying to decide what camera and lens set-up I wanted/needed and its a nightmare. I am new to forums and found them excellent, stacks of information, allthough obviously peoples opinions differ and they can send you nuts.

Prior to reading the forums I had decided that the lens I was after was the Canon 100-400 which is a very popular enthusiast level lens. All the image samples I'd seen, where phots I would be inspiring to take myself.

I ended up purchasing the Canon 300mm F4.0 IS and a 1.4x converter instaed. Allthough on Safari I can imagine that the zoom would be more practical. I am in no position to offer advice, but:-

I read a few times, that the push pull zoom system on the 100-400 does have a tendency to let in dust. I can't comment if this would become a major problem over a month. Others may be able to comment if that is your chosen lens.

I also looked at lens rental and it is expensive, I dont know if your allowed to reccomend sites, if not I apologise. google (hireacamera) reasonable prices don't know the restrictions.

Well good look and hope I've been a tad bit of help

You aye Ste

[glsammy]

Originally Posted by eeyore

one idea for back up could be to get a bridge camera like the panasonic FZ50 or FZ8 this has a fixed lens which generally equates to arround 35- 350mm (35mm equivalent) - probably not good enough for your main gear but better than nowt if your principal body breaks - the FZ8 is about 200 notes while the 50 is arround 300. whatever you do i certainly would go to africa for a month without some kind of back up - imagine what would happen if your only camera broke , got damaged, or stolen in week 1

I was just going to recommend this. As photography isn't your main aim, i.e. you only want the shots to help you with your art work, surely a DSLR is overkill.
I'd be tempted to go the Panasonic FZ50 or similar route and forget about DSLR, especially as you've no experience of using one. If I'd gone away within three months of getting my DSLR, I would have been desperately disappointed with the results. You need a fair amount of time to get used to the camera, and even more so the lens. A decent bridge camera would enable you to get shots good enough for your project.

[mh68]

The fz8 in particular has really dropped in price with the release of its successor the fz18,around £150 if you shop around online.....for less than the price of a DSLR body on its own, you could buy 2 fz8s (one as a spare), get a few spare batteries and plenty of memory, and you wouldnt have the worries of dealing with dust while out there too.Plus you can get good results just using them like a point and shoot set to auto, so no need to worry about settings etc.
A lad who posts on one of the camera forums I visit went to Kenya for his honyemoon, and came back with some cracking pics taken with the fz8.

Mark H

[eeyore]

Originally Posted by mh68

The fz8 in particular has really dropped in price with the release of its successor the fz18,around £150 if you shop around online.....for less than the price of a DSLR body on its own, you could buy 2 fz8s (one as a spare), get a few spare batteries and plenty of memory, and you wouldnt have the worries of dealing with dust while out there too.Plus you can get good results just using them like a point and shoot set to auto, so no need to worry about settings etc.
A lad who posts on one of the camera forums I visit went to Kenya for his honyemoon, and came back with some cracking pics taken with the fz8.

Mark H

and at that price you could also afford to get a tcon zoom extender to screw onto the filter threads to extend your range.

Its not often that i reccomend a bridge camera over dslr kit but if you want pics soley to help with the art rather than as primary works themselves as graham says this could be a good route to take

one point however is that the works of the FZ8 / FZ50 etc are not weather sealed so used in extremly dusty conditions some may still find its way inside - so like mark says take two and also be prepared for a certain amount of photoshopage on your return.

another point i forgot before is what are you doing about download ? - you could just take lots of flash memory , but it would work out more economic to take a downloader like (for example) the jobo giga one (arround 200 notes) unless you are taking, or will have access, to a laptop.

dont forget to get spare batteries for the downloader too ( I find a fully charged batt lasts about a week on my flashtrax downloading every night with the screen turned off, so if you dont have access to recharging facilities you would want at least 4 probably 5 batteries)

[mh68]

In the case of the FZ8, with its retracting lens, you can make it a little more dust proof by fitting a decent skylight filter to the lens hood adaptor,and leaving it fitted to the camera, effectively "sealing" the lens inside the adaptor/filter.Not perfect, but an improvement.


Mark H