Unidentified plant - help

Wig · #1 (**permalink**) 17-05-2009, 10:53 AM

Hi,

I am a bit wary of putting this unidentified post into the wild flowers forum as I don't know if it is a cultivar or non-native plant. So I looked for a more general forum and thought this one was best suited to my post.

The plant below grew last year, a fairly stunted low growth and never did anything, no flowers, I thought it might have been a stray cucumber or courgette seed from the compost bin.

It has "rough as sandpaper" leaves. And this year it has grown back really strongly and upright and is now 2 feet tall with multiple stems. Can't wait to see if it flowers. Can you identify it please?

A close up of the growing tip

The following is a picture of my Cirsium Rivulare Atropurpureum, which I am recommending to anyone who likes flowers for the bees and butterflies. I'd like to know if it is a native wild flower or is it a cultivar? Planted last summer as a 1 litre plant pot single stem specimen (it grew a couple more stems even in the first season) and look at the size of it this year! I like so much that I am going to grow seedlings from the seeds and create a whole bed of the stuff.

aeshna5 · #2 (**permalink**) 17-05-2009, 11:10 AM

Mystery plant looks like Nettle-leaved Bellflower, Campanula trachelium.

Cirsium rivulare isn't native, but obviously other Cirium species are. Agree it's a fine garden plant. Not sure of its origins- possibly eastern (something at the back of my mind says Japan, but may be wrong on this!)

Jez · #3 (**permalink**) 17-05-2009, 11:37 AM

I agree with Aeshna5, Nettle leaved Bellflower which if your not familiar with the flowers are blue and look a bit like foxgloves!

I planted a couple of Cirsium Rivulare Altopurpureum in my borders last year as a beneficial insect plant as well it's charming looks but as soon as the flower heads started to show they mysteriously where knocked off! I think it's either the pheasants or the once domesticated American Wild Turkey's which where set loose around the time of the bird flu doing the damage I'm not sure (whoever caused the damage must have found the bright flowers too much to resist)! I completely forgot all about that and must go check to if there's any new signs of life!

Cheers

Jez

KeenTeen17 · #4 (**permalink**) 26-05-2009, 09:42 PM

I agree with this ID. Here is a photo. Its a nice plant to have

Wig · #5 (**permalink**) 31-05-2009, 09:26 PM

Hi,

I don't think this is nettle-leaved campanula.

I was doubtful to begin with because it doesn't have orange stems, but I decided to give it a chance. It has now started to go into flower - at least that's what I think it is doing. The flowers are not flowers at all, just green bits with a green centre. This explains why last year I saw no flowers - it doesn't have any!

I got some close ups on the green "flowers" - they occur at the tip of the now fully grown stems and at the intersection of the leaves and the stems.

Can anyone identify it now?

Tiggrx · #6 (**permalink**) 31-05-2009, 09:31 PM

The green bits are buds which will open out into flowers. I think it is a Bellflower, but would think it is Clustered Bellflower (Campanula glomerata) rather than Nettle-leaved Bellflower.

Wig · #7 (**permalink**) 31-05-2009, 10:04 PM

From the images on the internet, the leaves don't match Campanula glomerata, and Campanula glomerata also has orangy stems without the sharp spines this plant has.

I really doubt the green bits will turn into flowers, because I know it didn't flower last year, and there is no structure inside these 'buds'. Still, only time will tell.

I also forgot to say it has a milky sap, when it gets damaged.

Thanks to everyone who tries to identify this one

Jez · #8 (**permalink**) 01-06-2009, 08:21 AM

Milky sap, spines and square stems! I have plenty of Nettle leaved Bellflower coming up at the moment, all stems are green, I think they turn woody when the flowers mature! Will take some photos for comparison though looking at your latest photos Wig I doubt it is NBF and I'm sitting here now scratching my head!

Wig · #9 (**permalink**) 01-06-2009, 09:49 AM

The stems are five sided, the five sides are more noticeable the closer to the growing tip you look. The "spines" I mentioned are not spines really, but hairs which grow along the "corners" of the stems Sorry for that bad description.

There is a milky sap throughout the plant, sort of magnolia colour.

The 'flowers' are in clusters a central one with about 5 smaller flowers around it.

As it grew next to my compost heap it may not be native, but it should bear fruit or vegetables if it came from the compost waste. Plus I don't eat many exotic foods, and I have already ruled out Physallis which I had growing 2 years ago from my compost. It can't be passion fruit either.

The stems do not turn woody (I know from last year) they all just rot away, and the plant dissappears completely below soil level over winter.

It is liked by those green bugs - froghoppers.

Jez · #10 (**permalink**) 01-06-2009, 06:31 PM

Very similar comparisons to be made here I think Wig. The stems look square but aren't they do have 5 sides, hairs running down the stems, but I wasn't prepared to break the stem for residue colour I'm affraid. Though what you mention I find interesting! you say the residue is purple now could this possibly be because the flowers colour will be purple if what you have is a Campanula!?! Personally I don't think it's Nettle Leaved Bellflower, I'm leaning towards Clustered Bellflower as Tiggrx mention due to the clump of five flower heads starting to show, looking though a couple of wildflower books none of the pictures show this flower with woody looking stems! That's all I can offer for now. Just hope it does come into flower as I'm curious to know what plant you have!

P.s Flowering time for Clustered Bellflower seems to be about right.