twin flower help.....

[diggleken]

Well, two flowers, not Twinflower............
Grateful for any help with these two, one appears to be a bellflower type, but its leaves and flower have me beat, its a loner, but is there in a local unused quarry every year:

then this one, I feel I should know it, it grows in a damp rocky trickle and this is the first time I've noticed a flower, each on just a single drooping stalk:

Thanks a lot
Ken

[Lancashire Lad]

Hi Ken,

Pretty sure the first is Jacob's Ladder - Polemonium caeruleum.

I'm struggling to recall the name of the second one at the minute, although I'm sure it's one that I know. - I'll keep thinking about it.

Regards,
Mike.

[Johnny81]

2nd looks like Alpine willowherb Epilobium anagallidifolium, although that is local in mountians in the north, and not something I've seen before.

[Dorts]

I agree with Mike. 1. is Jacob's Ladder - Polemonium caeruleum.
2. I'd say is New Zealand Willowherb - Epilobium brunnescens.
Dorts.

[Johnny81]

Originally Posted by Dorts

2. I'd say is New Zealand Willowherb - Epilobium brunnescens.
Dorts.

One I considered but looked smaller in my book, but I have never seen it so I'd run with your ID Dorts

[Lancashire Lad]

Originally Posted by Dorts

....2. I'd say is New Zealand Willowherb - Epilobium brunnescens....

Yes - that's what I was unsuccessfully trying to think of.

Regards,
Mike.

[diggleken]

Thanks a lot all of you, thats a great pair of ID's for most unusual pair of plants, round here anyway............maybe should be recorded?
Both have been thriving for years - I'll try and get better shots and post them.
Great stuff
Cheers
Ken

[ChrisJB]

Where is the Jacobs Ladder Ken? It grows up at Cragg Vale and I have also seen it near Jubilee Bends (in pasture above the old colliery) a few years back. However, the late Peter Hill once told me that any of our local examples would be almost certainly naturalised escapes. I have seen it in the wild at Lathkill Dale, where as I recall it was fenced off on account of its scarcity. It grows on scree at Malham Cove too.

Chris

[Dorts]

Originally Posted by diggleken

Thanks a lot all of you, thats a great pair of ID's for most unusual pair of plants, round here anyway............maybe should be recorded?
Both have been thriving for years - I'll try and get better shots and post them.
Great stuff
Cheers
Ken

Ken, maybe this distribution map will help with deciding whether to have the Willowherb recorded or not. (The Tetrad Maps do give more detail).

BSBI Maps Scheme: Hectad Map New Zealand Willow-herb.

Local knowledge is required to decide if the Jacob's Ladder is likely to be native or not, though all plants persisting in the wild should be recorded.
Dorts.

[diggleken]

Thanks both, I'll liaise with the local naturalists society - I'm sure Peter Hill (great man) would be right Chris - interesting its been there a few years but not spread, possibly as its in a limestone pocket and is otherwise not viable, maybe.
I went on a few excusrions to Winnats pass area a few years ago, never found it - always a sound decision to look more closely at home!
I've sent you an e-mail Chris for location.
Heath Speedwell there too - a most interesting site.
Cheers
Ken