Vice County Boundaries - Query

[Lancashire Lad]

For those who use it, the Where's The Path map site has now added DINTY Tetrad lookup along with VC numbers. It is included as another option, accessed by doubleclicking on the Gridref/Lat/Long display box, as described in earlier post.

Regards,
Mike.

[Meta menardi]

Just had time for a quick look, but very impressive, bookmarked for later looks.

[poschiavanus]

Sorry I missed this very interesting thread. A number of (rather lengthy) points:

• Boundaries derived from OS Maps. AlanS and others have described how they have created their own VC boundary maps. The process described appears to create 'derived data' and it thus technically belongs or partially belongs to the Ordnance Survey.
• OS OpenSpace (e.g., Where's the Path). I discussed the value of incorporating VC boundaries in the OS OpenSpace API (used by Where's the Path) with an OS representative at a workshop in June. It was obvious that there was already a substantial groundswell of support for this, so it is to be hoped that the boundaries will be available for other application builders.. There should be a good potential for incorporating various data available from NaturalEngland, such as SSSI boundaries or Ancient Woodlands. "Where's the Path?" has beaten them to it, but additional lobbying of the OS wouldn't harm.
• Using the NBN VC Boundaries. As stated elsewhere the NBN boundary set comes with substantial restrictions, but for individual use of this data I thoroughly recommend Quantum GIS, a pretty robust free software GIS package. More sophisticated users may also want to add PostGIS a geographically-aware database system, also available under cost-free license. Also, if anyone is interested, I can explain how to create a transparent overlay of vice-county boundaries for Garmin GPS devices - send me a PM. (I cant distribute the NBN data because of the license terms).
• Creating a completely free set of VC boundaries. All the OS derived sets of data still have substantial restrictions relating to how they have been derived, and the still open status of data from OS maps. I and others have been adding approximate boundaries for some Vice Counties to OpenStreetMap (OSM): mainly using old county boundaries from 1940's maps. If anyone with detailed knowledge of specific VC boundaries can provide input as to the precise alignment then I'd be more than happy to collaborate to get the data into OSM. Once there it can be exported into any suitable format (such as KML overlays for GoogleEarth, maps for MapMate, Shapefiles etc). This may be particularly relevant for Ireland as I am not aware of any equivalent of the NBN dataset. Again drop me a PM if interested.

Sorry to be so verbose, but am really pleased to see the degree of interest in this subject.

Posch

[OliP]

Further to poschiavanus' comments, it is actually a piece of cake to create your own kml (Google Earth) Watsonian VC boundaries from the free ESRI Shapefiles available from NBN (for personal use of course).

If you can download and install Quantum GIS, then you're most of the way there.

Here's how to do it:

1) Download and install Quantum GIS (Download - Quantum GIS Wiki choosing 'Windows Standalone Installer').

2) Double-click qGIS Setup file to install. Follow instructions.

3) Download the NBN Watsonan VC files (Resources - Mapping - National Biodiversity Network).

nb There are lots of options, choose 'Individual County Files Polylines folder', unless you want the dataset for the whole of Great Britain as one file, which you probably won't (if you do, it'll be a 216Mb kml (Google Earth) file once converted).

4)Right-click downloaded Watsonian VC .zip folder. Choose 'Extract all'.

5) You'll find another zipped folder. Extract this too, preferably to the Desktop. (May take a while, especially on an old pc, make a cup of tea).

5) Open folder (on Desktop) once extracted.

6) Find your county's Shapefile (in ESRI folder) e.g. Berwickshire_polyline.shp.

7) Copy this file somewhere memorable (to the Desktop?)

8) Open your new qGIS program (link should be on Desktop)

9) Go to: Layer --> Add Vector Layer in qGIS program (on tool-bar at top of qGIS window)

10)Click 'Browse' button and choose the .shp file you've copied to the Desktop. Make sure file type is '[OGR] ESRI Shapefiles'. Click 'Open'.

11) Now you have your boundary in qGIS. We need to export it. First you'll need to select this 'layer'.

12) Go to: View --> Select Features. This will give you a cursor with which you can drag a large box over the entire VC boundary. If you do this successfully the VC boundary line will change colour.

13) Go to: Layer --> Save Selection as vector file. Fill in the following: Format = Keyhole Markup Language; Save as = 'Insert appropriate file name here', Browse to an appropriate folder to save in.

14) For CRS (Coordinate Ref. System) click 'Browse'. Search using 'Name' for 'OSGB 1936 / British National Grid'. Select this, and click ok. Then click 'ok' on the 'Save vector layer as...' box.

15) Find your new kml file and open it in Google Earth. Marvel at your GIS prowess.

This would also be a good way to check all the boundaries for inputting to Open Street Map; unless this still counts as being 'derived' from OS data, though I'm not quite sure if simply using it as a visual guide counts as being derived in a legal sense, after all, you are not actually copying the underlying coordinate data.

Happy GIS'ing!

[poschiavanus]

This would also be a good way to check all the boundaries for inputting to Open Street Map; unless this still counts as being 'derived' from OS data, though I'm not quite sure if simply using it as a visual guide counts as being derived in a legal sense, after all, you are not actually copying the underlying coordinate data.

Just a note, for now the NBN boundaries are not a suitable source for adding to OpenStreetMap, not just because they are 'derived' from OSM data, but because NBN spent time and money digitising these boundaries and undoubtedly retain the copyright as described in the user license. The work was done on behalf of NBN by a commercial firm.

The second point is that Google have NOT given OpenStreetMap permission to use the maps, aerial imagery, and streetview imagery on their sites. So, again, please avoid using this.

Tedious I know, but these type of T&Cs are what make so much data difficult to use freely: precisely the issue which OSM is trying to solve.

14) For CRS (Coordinate Ref. System) click 'Browse'. Search using 'Name' for 'OSGB 1936 / British National Grid'. Select this, and click ok. Then click 'ok' on the 'Save vector layer as...' box.

You might find co-ordinates are a bit off with this approach. It all can get a bit hairy, but you may need a modified projection (ask me if you need to know). For instance the KML downloads from BSBI all seem to be about 100m out from an accurate 1 km National Grid.

Posch

PS. GPSBabel is a very useful tool for conversion from one format to another.

[OliP]

You might find co-ordinates are a bit off with this approach. It all can get a bit hairy, but you may need a modified projection (ask me if you need to know). For instance the KML downloads from BSBI all seem to be about 100m out from an accurate 1 km National Grid.

Thanks for the warning. As far as I can tell all the NBN VC boundaries seem to match up with the landmarks you'd expect them to in Google Earth.

I did have some problems with the NBN Polygon files, rather than Polylines. Also, qGIS has two OSGB 1936 export options, the one with '/ British National Grid' seems to work fine with the NBN Polyline data.

I haven't used the BSBI kml overlays for a while, but it'll be interesting to check that out.

So, correct me if I'm wrong, but there shouldn't be any problem with converting the NBN data for your own use in Google Earth or on a GPS unit, should there?

Thanks!

[calumma]

I have kml files for all Vice Counties and folks are welcome to request them (for free) by emailing me at database@kentarg.org

The original thread was started by somebody who wanted maps for Lancashire. I manage the recording database on behalf of the Lancashire ARG, so this is a map that I use on a regular basis.

This blog entry illustrates what the Kent map looks like in Google Earth.

[teresaf]

This post on a possible status change of the boundaries may also be of interest, if anything comes of it...
http://forums.nbn.org.uk/viewtopic.php?id=2224