Copyright Question

jennyb · #1 (**permalink**) 03-02-2006, 09:02 PM

I have searched on the site for information about the copyright of information and images on the site, but can only find posts indicating that we should not directly copy text from another source.

What I really would like to know is - who has copyright of the photographs that are uploaded on the site? There are some fantastic photographs. I would hate to think that outsiders may use them in breach of their copyright. More importantly, who retains the copyright - the person who uploads them or Wild About Britain?

Sorry if you already explain this somewhere on the site, but I have not been able to find it. If you have a copyright page, please direct me to it.

Thanks,

Jenny

digi · #2 (**permalink**) 03-02-2006, 09:14 PM

The copyright should remain with the owner, you can watermark images internally or add an external copyright mark.

Digi

Helen · #3 (**permalink**) 03-02-2006, 09:19 PM

Yes, copyright of photographs is with the owner, the person who took the photograph. This is taken very seriously on a lot of photography forums and site nowadays on the internet.

It is also a question of courtesy. If you want to download a photo from the internet for personal purposes, check first with the photographer. More often than not, they will be happy for you to do so.

jennyb · #4 (**permalink**) 03-02-2006, 09:31 PM

Thanks for your comments. I also read the post about watermarks which may be worth doing for some images.

On my own web site I have a lot of small images which when clicked will display a larger image. I deliberately made these larger images smaller than I would have preferred. Together with the low screen resolution, the opportunities to use them illegally is minimised.

Jenny

Fourwings · #5 (**permalink**) 03-02-2006, 09:39 PM

It's always going to be a problem, by simply posting an image on the internet you are putting that image at risk of being illegally re-produced, as a photographer it's a risk that you have to take if you want to show your work to this vast worldwide audience, watermarks & copyright tags will give a certain level of protection but are not fail-safe!

Thankfully the size of image required by sites such as this means that the file is greatly reduced in both physical size & resolution & therefore far less usefull to anyone wishing to copy it illegally.

The best advice is to choose wisely where you post your images & use internal watermarks.

StuartDH · #6 (**permalink**) 03-02-2006, 10:15 PM

Hi Jennyb,

The copyright always stays with the original author/photographer, and the only thing we ask for is non-exclusive rights to reproduce the images anywhere on the site - so basically, a photo in the gallery can be used in the reference section etc.

Here's a couple of places that we've got some of the legal info:

In the rules of the forum when you first register - "We reserve the right to publish member's original content anywhere within the Wild About Britain website without notification."

and in the reference > information > terms and conditions page:

"Copyright and trade marks

The copyright laws of both local and foreign nations protect the content on this Site.
Users may not breach the copyright or other intellectual property rights, moral rights or any other rights of Wild About Britain or any third party.

Reproduction, storage, modification or distribution of any Content requires the written consent and all necessary permissions and license by a duly authorised representative of Wild About Britain or, where applicable, the respective copyright owner(s).

Users may not use the names and logos of Wild About Britain and all related trademarks, trade names, product and service names and designs without the prior written consent of a duly authorised representative of Wild About Britain.

All Content and works in the nature of databases attract database rights. "

Stu

nightshade · #7 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 06:19 AM

There has been at least one suggestion that people might like to send pics. into competitions,competition organisers should state up front that copywright is still with the photographer,some do take liberties and take the copywright and sell entries on so beware
I posted a thread this am about an eagle owl it would have been easy to digitally reproduce the images but it belongs to the newspaper or their source
should wab have a copywright statement on its front page?

digi · #8 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nightshade

I posted a thread this am about an eagle owl it would have been easy to digitally reproduce the images but it belongs to the newspaper or their source
should wab have a copywright statement on its front page?

Maybe we should, I know that Airliners.net watermark and print a copyright banner on the image after upload because the media just pinch images from the site without asking. I believe even the BBC have done than from what I can remember.

Digi

nightshade · #9 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 09:19 AM

an excellent idea Digi,I know Stud is very good at these things

StuartDH · #10 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 10:00 AM

Yep, we could do that. Here's one we made earlier that we could easily add to all the pics in the gallery.

wildone · #11 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 10:02 AM

Yes, I like it Stuart. Very tasteful.

Fourwings · #12 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 01:27 PM

Looks good to me Stu - far less intrusive to an image than standard copyright text, yet still plainly viewable - I've got no problems with it being added to my images.

Helen · #13 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 02:58 PM

But hang on, the copyright doesn't belong to WAB, it belongs to the photographer?

Helen · #14 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 03:02 PM

The WAB image surely can just be cropped?

StuartDH · #15 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 03:29 PM

Hi Helen,

I know what you mean, we've avoided adding a copyright to the images in the past because we don't want to give the impression that Wild About Britain took or own the photos.

The watermark is a bit different, mainly because it isn't a copyright notice, instead it's a mark to say where the photo was published. This just protects the image a bit from things like hotlinking - setting up a website and filling it with thousands of images which are hosted on wild about britain, but are being viewed through someone else's site (with their own header, adverts etc).

It also give some protection from others grabbing the photo - some people don't know how to get rid of watermarks and, even when they do, they usually keep on looking elsewhere to find a different photo that they don't have to edit.

It's never perfect either way, so we'll happily wait to hear what the general consensus is before adding/not adding a watermark to the pics.

Stu

Helen · #16 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 03:43 PM

Can't you just prevent right-clicking on the images?

StuartDH · #17 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 04:02 PM

Yep, but that wouldn't prevent a screenshot. Unfortunately, for every security measure, there are usually a dozen ways around it.

At least with a watermark, the person who takes an image and removes the watermark, can't claim that they didn't know what they were doing and that they couldn't use the photo.

nightshade · #18 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 04:22 PM

Please do not stop right clicking.I use pics. from the gallery as wallpaper,a different one every week,to get me through the grey days
The WAB watermark looks good though thanks StuDH

digi · #19 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StuDH

At least with a watermark, the person who takes an image and removes the watermark, can't claim that they didn't know what they were doing and that they couldn't use the photo.

I think the watermark is okay, I don't mind WAB using my images but others must know they have a copyright.

I have been inolved on copyright violation when someone tried to pinch one of my images tregister it in the USA then wanted $47,000 compensation. I engaged a lawyer and he was dealt with but for every 10 that ignore this, one person will be frightened and pay up! So beware people out there will steal your work and then try to charge you for using it!

Helen · #20 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 05:10 PM

I also think it's common courtesy to ask the photographer, when wanting to download an image even for personal use. Most of the time, the photographer will be happy to say yes.

digi · #21 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Helen

I also think it's common courtesy to ask the photographer, when wanting to download an image even for personal use. Most of the time, the photographer will be happy to say yes.

I agree Helen, but there is not much courtesy around these days.

glsammy · #22 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 05:39 PM

I'll just be happy to have taken a picture worthy of being copied...

Seriously, I've no objection to the mark being placed on my images.

jennyb · #23 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 06:16 PM

I seem to have stirred up a hornet's nest!

I think that there should be a prominent copyright statement on each page of the gallery indicating that the copyright of each image belongs to the person who took the photograph. Additionally, I agree that a watermark indicating where the photograph came from should be added to each photograph. However, maybe the WAB watermark that you showed as an example could be modified to indicate that the image came from WAB but that WAB does not hold the copyright - I don't know exactly how it should be worded.

I also think this would help with respect to "bandwidth theft" where people point to WAB images from their own site. Depending on what your bandwidth restrictions are from your web host, this could be very expensive for WAB.

One more thing - a copyright statement in the footer of each page of the site, would probably be a good idea too.

Jenny

jennyb · #24 (**permalink**) 04-02-2006, 06:22 PM

Oops! I see there is a copyright statement on a lot of pages. Can I make another suggestion - on the footer where you have the copyright statement, you have a link to the WAB home page. Would it be better to have this link go to the copyright information page? I searched everywhere for that copyright information before originally posting this thread and did not find it.

Jenny

StuartDH · #25 (**permalink**) 05-02-2006, 11:26 AM

I've changed the 'Copyright' text at the bottom of the pages so that they now link through to the terms and conditions page and I've also added the text, "
Photograph is copyright the original photographer", below the images in gallery.

However, we're really not too keen about modifying the watermark to indicate that the image came from WAB, but that WAB does not hold the copyright etc. Ideally, I'd like the images to have no watermarks at all and adding even more info would probably spoil the image.

One of the primary aims and objectives of Wild About Britain as a charity is to share knowledge and resources that help to promote British wildlife. Personally I've no problem with anyone using my images, as long as they don't claim ownership or seek to profit from them. I'd have no problem with teachers using them in lesson plans, or doctors framing them and putting them in up their surgery etc - it's all OK with me, as long as it helps to promote British wildlife.

As mentioned before, there are always ways around watermarks and anyone who's really intent on stealing images will usually get away with it. For that reason, if you've got any particularly prized images, it's probably best to simply not post them.

Stu