A new way to exploite?

[Garden Carpet]

Just read this in the Times online,thought it would make a good discussion for a thread here.

New law may stop hunts using birds of prey to pursue foxes - Britain - Times Online

I have mixed feelings about this. I am not convinced these birds should be used in this way. I do not like Fox hunting at all
jaki

[fbcpmike]

I would agree that birds of prey should not be allowed to be used to hunt foxes, it's just another way to get around the current legislation. It's been banned (too long coming as well), move on, find something else to do, there is plenty else in the countryside that needs help, use the new found time productivley

As for Birds of prey and hunting, was it not a long practised "tradition" for hundreds of years to do this, and still is in the Middle East. I would like to thing that birds used for this are cared for ?.

[canonman]

Seems to me that they are trying to get around the ban.
I am not sure if the people who are supposed to be looking after the birds have the expertise on the bird’s welfare.
What will happen to the birds if the ban becomes law, will they just release them or have them put down, either way it does not look good for the birds.
I have never been to a hunt, and don’t think I want to, I have never been if favor of killing something in the name of sport
Mick

[Garden Carpet]

Originally Posted by fbcpmike

I would agree that birds of prey should not be allowed to be used to hunt foxes, it's just another way to get around the current legislation. It's been banned (too long coming as well), move on, find something else to do, there is plenty else in the countryside that needs help, use the new found time productivley

As for Birds of prey and hunting, was it not a long practised "tradition" for hundreds of years to do this, and still is in the Middle East. I would like to thing that birds used for this are cared for ?.

Not according to the article above fbcpmike.... 'sitting in their own muck' ... Yes they have been used to hunt for hundreds of years... hunts have been running hundreds of years too.. didnt make them right. Birds hunting for themselves... great.... birds hunting for some human's pot... not great.
jaki

[batwing]

I am against hunting full stop but on moving to the country a few years ago I attended our local Boxing Day hunt out of curiosity. The first year was exceptionally well attended but I put that down to being the last before the ban. Last year (the first using a bird of prey) however was just the same. It is incredibly well supported by ordinary people. I think it's a bit like litter - everyone condemns it and agrees it's wrong but somehow it still happens!

[batwing]

Oh, and by the way, the meet is not nearly as glamourous as portrayed on TV etc. There's a lot of people with very red faces on fine horses but wearing very shoddy jackets that don't appear to have been cleaned for several years and a really strong smell of alcohol. Not nice at 10.30 in the morning.

[speckled wood]

Its just another example of the usual reaction to legislation that they don't like, "We've always done this" Its tradition". I expect that these glorious hunters would like the laws on birds nesting and collecting finches to be removed. Oh lets go the whole hog and start kicking the village "idiot", and burning witches no matter that he/she is perhaps autistic or has some other medical condition, its tradition we've always done this. And if we get caught out we play the innocent or try dumb insolence.

Surely enough though just like the egg collectors and drink drivers the Fox "hunters" (truthfully they are not even hunting) more people will realise that what they do is no longer acceptable and they will gradually become more and more isolated.

[nightshade]

Not everyone appreciates wildlife but they are only doing what our ancestors did
whatever the rights or wrongs it is something primal

[speckled wood]

Originally Posted by nightshade

Not everyone appreciates wildlife but they are only doing what our ancestors did
whatever the rights or wrongs it is something primal

But it still does not mean that they should carry on doing it any more than we should go back to using small children to sweep chimneys.

[The Valley sparrow]

I've always liked to stay neutral on the Fox hunting subject. But there must be some sort of control measure on the Fox. If not, the more vunerable species in the countryside would pay the price. It also seems that most of the complaints are simply proparganda, for i am sure that many of the hunt supporters, would have had been keen falconers well before the bill came in, and therefore well able to look after their birds.

[speckled wood]

Originally Posted by The Valley sparrow

I've always liked to stay neutral on the Fox hunting subject. But there must be some sort of control measure on the Fox. If not, the more vunerable species in the countryside would pay the price. It also seems that most of the complaints are simply proparganda, for i am sure that many of the hunt supporters, would have had been keen falconers well before the bill came in, and therefore well able to look after their birds.

That's all right then, so perhaps we should also use horses and hounds to hunt feral cats and escaped ferrets ..... after all it seems that most of the complaints are simply propaganda. We can bring back Badger Baiting for the same reason and maybe hunt Hedgehogs too.... Think of all the Frogs that they eat! Tally Ho!!!

[speckled wood]

Originally Posted by speckled wood

That's all right then, so perhaps we should also use horses and hounds to hunt feral cats and escaped ferrets ..... after all it seems that most of the complaints are simply propaganda. We can bring back Badger Baiting for the same reason and maybe hunt Hedgehogs too.... Think of all the Frogs that they eat! Tally Ho!!!

A better idea for these wannabe hunters .... read wannabe lawbreakers would be to grow up and get a life.

[honeybee]

Originally Posted by The Valley sparrow

I've always liked to stay neutral on the Fox hunting subject. But there must be some sort of control measure on the Fox. If not, the more vunerable species in the countryside would pay the price. It also seems that most of the complaints are simply proparganda, for i am sure that many of the hunt supporters, would have had been keen falconers well before the bill came in, and therefore well able to look after their birds.

Don't really understand what you mean by this.

The countryside alliance are the worst in the world for propaganda, god knows where their statistics come from..pie in the sky.

I used to be very close (although not involved) to the hunting scene simply because I knew a lot of people who hunted (cotswold hunt / VWH / Beaufort etc) some with royalty. I don't know of one who had anything to do with falconry. Don't want to start a hunting debate again, it's been done before.

Yes it is another form of exploitation and the pros worming their way through a loophole.

[batwing]

Originally Posted by The Valley sparrow

I've always liked to stay neutral on the Fox hunting subject. But there must be some sort of control measure on the Fox. If not, the more vunerable species in the countryside would pay the price. It also seems that most of the complaints are simply proparganda, for i am sure that many of the hunt supporters, would have had been keen falconers well before the bill came in, and therefore well able to look after their birds.

When I lived in the London suburbs I would see foxes almost daily, in the gardens or round the back of the local chicken-in-a-box take away.
I must admit that I have not seen a single Fox since moving to the country but I doubt this is due to the hunt as it just doesn't happen that often.

[The Valley sparrow]

I'm sorry if my veiws seem to offend some of you,but, they are mine. Also i agree with you there Honeybee, the pro's use alot of propaganda, as well as the anti's. This is why i don't believe in a word that they say. I keep my own mind open, to what, i personally see.
There are 36 Falconers or Birders in my immediate area, all love and care for their birds. 14 of these are good friends of mine, and many follow the you now who's, including The Vale of The White Horse.

[honeybee]

Originally Posted by The Valley sparrow

I'm sorry if my veiws seem to offend some of you,but, they are mine. Also i agree with you there Honeybee, the pro's use alot of propaganda, as well as the anti's. This is why i don't believe in a word that they say. I keep my own mind open, to what, i personally see.
There are 36 Falconers or Birders in my immediate area, all love and care for their birds. 14 of these are good friends of mine, and many follow the you now who's, including The Vale of The White Horse.

Always up for a bit of friendly debate. Just don't know how you can "sit on the fence" about a subject like that. However as i said I knew a lot of people that hunted and I also knew sabs. The pros new I was against but i suppose I could be frowned upon for having anything at all to do with them but it did give me a good insight into their way of thinking.