Cutting Edge: Meet the Foxes

[Kymba]

Tonite on
Channel 4 from 21:00 to 22:00

First in a new series of the documentary strand. Archive footage of dozens of foxes is used to create the story of a fictional family of the creatures in London, living on food thrown out by humans and getting into a variety of scrapes. The programme highlights the real-life struggle for survival many such creatures face in today's urbanised Britain

[scholesy]

Was just about to put a thread up about this programme.

Heres a link to the programms channel 4 webpage:

Cutting Edge from Channel4.com


I can imagine that this programme could provoke some quite strong opinions concerning the content and views depicted.

If it starts a discussion in this thread then maybe it could be moved into the 'mammals forum'.

i'll be watching with interest.

[demicav]

I always feel a bit sad when I watch these programmes. They're very good and depict real life scenarios and that really brings it home to me what a bad time foxes have surviving. Won't be easy viewing for me, I'm a bit of a softy like that.

[Kymba]

I have a real soft spot for Foxes
Was woken again at 4 am this morning by Two young foxes screeching and playing in the street.. sat at the window for 15 minutes watching them. i did take a photo but they weren't close to the street light so the photo was to dark to see them. but will try again next time

[eeyore]

I dont like the anthropomorphic need to "tell a story" why cant they just broadcast footage of wild foxes doing foxy fings - remember night of the Fox by BBC NHU and the oxford Wildcru - storming programme

mind you i supose the story telling helps engage children and joe public so I'm up with it to that extent - it just doesnt do it for me

[brainfarmer]

id go along with that eeyore they are cute varmints but if i kept chickens i wouldnt hesitate to shoot them.
i think this prog did a good service. it showed both sides of the debate and it didnt shy away from showing the darker side of wildlife. it may seem strange but i thought were the foxes got shot were handled in a very good way - very little emotion. i love foxes and despite the way it was handled i did shed a tear when she copped it. i know it was a docu thing but hats off to c4.

[Kayleigh]

That man with the chickens wants shooting the B. Why did he not put heaver fencing round the coop instead of thin chicken wire the Fox's just bit through. I can see his point of view but in my view he did not do all he could to secure his chickens there was no need to get a hit man in to kill them. He didn't even try to protect his chickens his wife was going on about attracting wildlife with the pond ect what did she think Fox's are. They build houses all over the countryside taking the Fox's habitat away then when they come into cities they don't like it.

We used to have Fox's in our garden in our old house. My neighbours had chickens and they never lost one chicken.
The gun should have been a last resort not a first.

[Words]

Couldn't agree more about the idiocy of shooting rather than getting sensible fencing around the coop.

It would have been good to have a bit more sensible advice in there (ie vast quantities of food being left out isn't too helpful, and feeding them cakes is totally beyond me ).

[demicav]

Originally Posted by Kayleigh

That man with the chickens wants shooting the B. Why did he not put heaver fencing round the coop instead of thin chicken wire the Fox's just bit through. I can see his point of view but in my view he did not do all he could to secure his chickens there was no need to get a hit man in to kill them. He didn't even try to protect his chickens his wife was going on about attracting wildlife with the pond ect what did she think Fox's are. They build houses all over the countryside taking the Fox's habitat away then when they come into cities they don't like it.

We used to have Fox's in our garden in our old house. My neighbours had chickens and they never lost one chicken.
The gun should have been a last resort not a first.

I couldn't agree more. Foxes are wildlife are they not ? Yes of course they are, they're lovely and they're persecuted for doing nothing more than trying to survive. Mankind disgust me sometimes.

[brainfarmer]

i think your missing the point it wasnt an in depth look at urban foxes it was a look at the reactions to them. of course the guy could have made his coop Fox proof and those that fed the foxes could have been told not to.

[Kymba]

Well personally the Programme left me so Angry. To the point I had to calm down before i could come on here
Firstly I thought the whole thing was extremely well done.. good on you C4
But the Pompous twit ( being polite) needed shooting. Why didn't they shut the chickens up inside the shed at night!!!
When are certain people going to realise that is our fault foxes have come into the towns, It is us that has built houses on all available countryside destroying their Habitats. Its us that leave bags of rubbish out on the streets encouraging the to go through them for food!!
The foxes didn't ask for their habitat to be destroyed
But how lovely were the Old couple that fed and filmed them And the two men who rescued and cared for injured ones
Even the lady who was worried about the one with Mange really cared.. Give me people like that everytime..
As for the rich Pompous twit if he wants to be green and Eco friend move to the countryside,and do it properly.. because guess what Foxes are all part of going back to nature.. You can't only be green on bits that suit you.... (puts soap box away)

[Ukwildlifeo]

I forgot to watch the programme DOH!

But as for feeding foxes and creating high population densities that cause mange; heres a photo of a Fox with mange:



What makes it worse is the fact this is the better of the two foxes i saw at my local park. the other had a thin tail (no fur on it) and half its body fur missing

[eeyore]

the trouble is that having created an artificially high population if many people now stop feeding we will see a population crash with malnourished and dying cubs and lack of food will also lead to poor condition and fighting amonst the adults

[demicav]

Originally Posted by Kymba

Well personally the Programme left me so Angry. To the point I had to calm down before i could come on here
Firstly I thought the whole thing was extremely well done.. good on you C4
But the Pompous twit ( being polite) needed shooting. Why didn't they shut the chickens up inside the shed at night!!!
When are certain people going to realise that is our fault foxes have come into the towns, It is us that has built houses on all available countryside destroying their Habitats. Its us that leave bags of rubbish out on the streets encouraging the to go through them for food!!
The foxes didn't ask for their habitat to be destroyed
But how lovely were the Old couple that fed and filmed them And the two men who rescued and cared for injured ones
Even the lady who was worried about the one with Mange really cared.. Give me people like that everytime..
As for the rich Pompous twit if he wants to be green and Eco friend move to the countryside,and do it properly.. because guess what Foxes are all part of going back to nature.. You can't only be green on bits that suit you.... (puts soap box away)

Excellent post. Well said!

[pressld2]

It seems to me that shooting the foxes in your garden, apart from any moral or ethical considerations, is pointless, futile and a complete waste of time. All it achieves is an empty territory which, given the current population level, another Fox will move into within weeks, if not days. Shoot that one and the same thing will happen. And again. And again...

[Kymba]

Originally Posted by Ukwildlifeo

I forgot to watch the programme DOH!

But as for feeding foxes and creating high population densities that cause mange; heres a photo of a Fox with mange:



What makes it worse is the fact this is the better of the two foxes i saw at my local park. the other had a thin tail (no fur on it) and half its body fur missing

The programme is repeated on Sunday at 10pm on More 4 for those that missed it.

Most cases of mange in foxes are in southern England, with a cluster in the Midlands and scattered reports from elsewhere. The disease is caused by a parasitic mite called Sarcoptes scabiei, which burrows into the skin. Several thousand mites may be found in just one square centimetre of skin. They secrete waste that hardens into a thick crust on the skin, causing hair loss and lacerations, leaving the Fox susceptible to other infections. Weight loss and organ and tissue damage are common symptoms. Death usually follows within six months. Infected foxes suffer considerable distress, often gnawing at their limbs and tail.
If anybody has foxes with mange I have a link to somewhere that will send you something to treat them with free of charge.
NFWS - Mange Site - Homepage

Or you can contact your local wildlife rescue centre (there is a thread with lots of addresses all round the country) some will also send you stuff to treat them.

[bendog]

We recorded the programme and watched it tonight. Some of the "information" was not totally accurate. We lived with foxes in our garden for 14 years. We fed them regularly with dog food, scraps (they were not keen on rice!) and Marmite sandwiches. I think it was when I was looking up some information about urban foxes and mange that I read that Marmite seems to give them, somehow, some protection against mange. Our foxes were definitely healthy! We deliberately made no effort to tame them and I filmed or photographed them from the house. At one time, I used to broadcast "Fox Cam" for my friends all over the world to watch. Since we have moved here, I really miss them.
The guy with the gun on the programme stated that foxes kill cats. I was told by a man from the League Against Cruel Sports that there is no evidence of this. What may happen is that people who claim that this has happened is that their cat or the cat they see "taken" by the Fox was either dead or dying. He told me that a Fox will not tangle with a healthy cat as the risk of injury is too great. In my own experience, we have always had about 4 cats, the foxes have either ignored the cats and vice versa or, in the case of one of my cats, have been chased away by them! For some reason this cat saw it as her duty to chase foxes whenever she heard one in the garden.
I have posted pictures of our foxes on this site before, but thought this one could do with a re-airing at this time. A Fox cub and a cat meet for the first time here. This picture was taken by pure luck.

[demicav]

Originally Posted by bendog

We recorded the programme and watched it tonight. Some of the "information" was not totally accurate. We lived with foxes in our garden for 14 years. We fed them regularly with dog food, scraps (they were not keen on rice!) and Marmite sandwiches. I think it was when I was looking up some information about urban foxes and mange that I read that Marmite seems to give them, somehow, some protection against mange. Our foxes were definitely healthy! We deliberately made no effort to tame them and I filmed or photographed them from the house. At one time, I used to broadcast "Fox Cam" for my friends all over the world to watch. Since we have moved here, I really miss them.
The guy with the gun on the programme stated that foxes kill cats. I was told by a man from the League Against Cruel Sports that there is no evidence of this. What may happen is that people who claim that this has happened is that their cat or the cat they see "taken" by the Fox was either dead or dying. He told me that a Fox will not tangle with a healthy cat as the risk of injury is too great. In my own experience, we have always had about 4 cats, the foxes have either ignored the cats and vice versa or, in the case of one of my cats, have been chased away by them! For some reason this cat saw it as her duty to chase foxes whenever she heard one in the garden.
I have posted pictures of our foxes on this site before, but thought this one could do with a re-airing at this time. A Fox cub and a cat meet for the first time here. This picture was taken by pure luck.

That's a really nice photo. They both look curious.

[Kymba]

Originally Posted by pressld2

It seems to me that shooting the foxes in your garden, apart from any moral or ethical considerations, is pointless, futile and a complete waste of time. All it achieves is an empty territory which, given the current population level, another Fox will move into within weeks, if not days. Shoot that one and the same thing will happen. And again. And again...

That was the great thing about this programme.
The Twit (being polite) thats had the two foxes shot
Ended up several months later with more Foxes in his garden

City Folk cant be Country Folk when they have City Folk attitudes
Oh why, Oh why do they think they can

[demicav]

Originally Posted by Kymba

That was the great thing about this programme.
The Twit (being polite) thats had the two foxes shot
Ended up several months later with more Foxes in his garden

City Folk cant be Country Folk when they have City Folk attitudes
Oh why, Oh why do they think they can

It seems to be a problem all over. People that are used to living in towns and cities moving to the country and basically spoiling it. Not enough people are educated on wildlife and environment issues. The other day I spoke to someone who didn't even know what an Adder was, my own children are more educated than that.

[Kymba]

Originally Posted by demicav

It seems to be a problem all over. People that are used to living in towns and cities moving to the country and basically spoiling it. Not enough people are educated on wildlife and environment issues. The other day I spoke to someone who didn't even know what an Adder was, my own children are more educated than that.

I know what you mean.. Being a country Girl it is something that really gets my hackles up

[eeyore]

Originally Posted by Kymba

City Folk cant be Country Folk when they have City Folk attitudes
Oh why, Oh why do they think they can

I know exactly what you mean - a farmer I know has a lawsuit pending against him from the yuppie halfwit who bought the house next door to the farm - apparentlyhe is alledging common nuisance due to the smell of silage - the farm , and silage pit have been there for over 75 years - the house is new - go back to the town bimble brain

[eeyore]

Originally Posted by demicav

The other day I spoke to someone who didn't even know what an Adder was

its one of those things wot we used before we had calculators an' 'at , innit geezer