Insects for id.

[glsammy]

Can anyone confirm the id of these?

I know the first is a Harvestman, but which one?







This one is small, around 2mm long. Plenty of them around on rotting damp timber.





Thanks.

[ChrisR]

The second is Collembola - a springtail - very primitive 6-legged invertebrates that are technically not included in insects any more

[Jason Green]

Afternoon Graham,

It may be best to re-post your Harvestman in the Spider sub-forum. Do you have a dorsal photograph? That would really help.

As for the second, as Chris says it's a Springtail - likely a Tomocerus sp., such as T. minor or vulgaris. The size points to the former in my opinion - most that I ID as vulgaris are bigger, though it just be young.

The differenciation is based on mouthparts as far as I am aware.

Take care,

Jason

[glsammy]

I know they're Arachnids and not spiders, hence why I posted it under general insects.
That's about as far as my knowledge goes!
Unfortunately I didn't get any other clear shots.

[Jason Green]

Originally Posted by glsammy

I know they're Arachnids and not spiders, hence why I posted it under general insects.
That's about as far as my knowledge goes!

Arachnids are in the Arachnida class. Within this are Spiders, Harvestmen and Mites. Spiders are in the 'Araneae' order, and Harvestmen in 'Opiliones' - both of which are level-pegging in the Order, and so often grouped alongside. This is why a lot of the time members post Opiliones in the Spider sub-forum, and where those who specialise in them tend to look for ID requests first in my experience.

I certainly know what you mean though, and it probably doesn't really matter. My preference is to put Harvestmen in the Spider forum solely because of grouping (I place Spiders, Harvestmen and Mites within the same section on my website).

An excellent picture by the way - the MPe-65 is impressive, as are your skills

[glsammy]

No problem Jason I'll move it over.
I was just excusing my ignorance.

[Jason Green]

Ignorance? Never - guess what I did about 18mths ago? I posted my first Harvestman asking for an ID on a long-legged Spider! Now that's embarrassing

I'll try and dig-out the thread...

Here you go... Long-legged spider ID please!

[Geoff F]

Harvestmen can be a bit tricky to ID from a photo without seeing the 'classic angles'. So how about a bit of help here. Time of year, habitat and size would help. Ideally, it is the length of the second leg which tends to separate the similar looking species. But overall size can also be important with some of the uncommon species.

So, just going by guesswork, and a rather rough guess at that, I am tempted to think about Paroligolophus agrestis. Average body size but a bit short in the second leg department, 14 to 18 mm with a body length of 4 or 5 mm.

Classic colours are a bit reddish (or pink) with some silvery grey patches and sometimes with a darker body 'saddle' mark particularly in males. But colours can be quite variable.

The ocularium (eye turret) is rather plain, which matches, although possibly a bit pale. In front of the eyes there are a group of spines on the 'nose' which is another good sign. A close up of the central spine assembly would be very helpful. A top down shot would also be useful.

I will have another think but hopefully Gordon will be along with an expert opinion soon.

ps. where to place harvestmen, was discussed in great detail when this site was redesigned recently. My opinion is that although they are a special case, 6 legs equals insect while 8 legs means spider. But that is a rather crude assessment.

[Action_Man]

One of only a few Opiliones that doesent really need the thumbnail expanding, its a typical female Paroligolophus agrestis.

They have a small forward facing trident with three small denticulae close to the eye turret, the orangey brown abdomen is a big give-away, these are one of the most abundant Opiliones (of the short legged variety) in my garden ...

Paroligolophus agrestis (Opiliones)

[glsammy]

Thank you all for the information. Very helpful.
Geoff, next time I'll make it clear exactly when the shot was taken, although with me it's pretty well certain it's been taken the day it's uploaded here for id!
I'll also give a brief outline of habitat etc.