Focus problems with low flying owls

[KentYeti]

I'm struggling a bit at present to get proper focus on the low flying, more distant Short Eared Owls on the Isle of Sheppey.

I just wonder if it's just me, or if I'm expecting too much from my gear.

Nikon D7000, Nikon 300mm f4 with /without 1.4 and 1.7 Teleconverters.

It's not the closer shots where the Owl has some seperation from the background. Where the background in such closer shots tends to be sky, or a bland green field etc.

It's the more distant shots where the Owl is sometimes, but not always, close to the background foliage that at present is quite close to the colour of the Owl. Most of those shots are out of focus, the camera seemingly focussing on the background and not the Owl.

I'm using the single focus point which is very small, and makes it hard to get onto a distant moving object that can be jinking around quite a bit. Using more focus points does not help: the camera certainly focusses on the background then!

I'm not losing great "master shots" with this problem. But the D7000 will allow me to crop 100% in decent sunshine, so I'd like to be able to get the occasional more distant shot in focus.

I had plenty of opportunities to practice and test today. And I am sure some of the out of focus stuff did see me just get the focus point on the bird before pressing the shutter. I took a lot of shots! All I got was one shot in focus, purely because the Owl was so close to the background foliage everything in the shot was in focus! So it made for an OK record shot but no more than that.

I would add that when shooting perched or almost stationary birds, even in poor light as for my Barn Owl shots on Elmley earlier this year, there are no such problems.

Which makes me think it's a focus speed issue. Either Yeti is too slow to get the focus point on the right place, and/or the camera is just not focussing fast enough in the very short time it has before the Owl jinks off the focus point.

Any views and/or similiar experiences out there?

Cheers,

Bryan

[PMG]

I would say the problem is a bit of everything, you're not as quick as the owl is a definite! The distance from the main subject and the background being so similar in tone the camera is confused as to what you want from it. I've had exactly the same problems last year with SEO's at Worlaby and I began to think it was me or that I couldn't photograph something flying - then I got a pick of the week of the owl flying towards me - and I think I got this cos I cropped the wings off to draw attention to its eyes - it was controversial and some didn't like it - but the photo editor did so thats all that matters in this case!!! I asked around quite a bit wondering what sort of hit rate other folk were getting - as I could track the bird and shoot off a volley and maybe one shot would be pin sharp. It seems this is most folks experience and way of going about it. I belive but its only a suspicion I have but I reckon from seeing results that some of the Nikon lenses produce a slightly sharper quality than the Canon and of course it depends on which lens - the 300 2.8 is going to beat the 500 5.6 if the bird is near enough. Attach it to a 5D and the results will be sharper, cleaner, crisper in every way - I've decided the whole business is a trade off between equipement quality, how sharp you are on the day, the light, the bird, how near it comes, the light when it gets good and close and when you've got all that under control have you pressed the shutter at the right millisecond ............

My advice is just keep hammering at it till something happens - either a fantastic shot which knocks yer socks off or a heart attack or there's always the extreme reaction - flinging camera in the ditch and marching away

Pauline

[KentYeti]

Very helpful indeed Pauline. Especially the sentence that starts, "I've had exactly the same problems last year with SEO's at Worlaby and I began to think it was me or that I couldn't photograph something flying...." Quite a comfort actually, I shall sleep better for that comment tonight.

I still tend to shoot in single shots, nearly 50 years of doing that isn't easy to change from! So maybe a burst will help sometimes.

Another clue, is something I didn't mention in my post above. With the D7000 and lenses, (the same for all digi DSLRs?), I can hear the lens focus motor at work, it sort of clicks! And in the sort of situation I mentioned of an SOE flying low some way off and with the background quite close, it is "clicking" almost continuously. Hunting in fact. I presume focussing on and off the owl and on and off the background. All happening at a very fast rate.

Thankfully I am getting the odd close fly by and a few quite good shots. Except for todays single close fly by, when the SOE came out from behind the tree I was using for cover. And stupidly I tried to focus too early and got a close branch of the tree focussed, so much so that the focus wouldn't change when I then pointed straight at the owl. It's something that does happen sometimes with my Nikon set up, (my D80 did it too). I use the 3m to infinity setting which is supposed to stop that, but not always. Takes maybe 5 seconds to sort it out. But in 5 seconds an SOE that has suddenly come across a Yeti is a very long way off!

The joys of bird in flight photography. LOL!

Cheers,

Bryan

[DOXHOPE]

Something not right there matie..I use the same lense (which is regarded as one of the sharpest on the market) on my D700 and my D300, owls are what I regard to be "easy" for BIF shots..I have have many sharp images of these and birds that I consider to be more difficut..someone may need to assist you with the camera setting
And 5 seconds to sort out, never heard that one before...definately a problem there

[KentYeti]

Originally Posted by DOXHOPE

Something not right there matie..I use the same lense (which is regarded as one of the sharpest on the market) on my D700 and my D300, owls are what I regard to be "easy" for BIF shots..I have have many sharp images of these and birds that I consider to be more difficut..someone may need to assist you with the camera setting
And 5 seconds to sort out, never heard that one before...definately a problem there

The Nikon 300mm f4lens is superb, at the focal length only bettered for sharpness by the 300mm f2.8 from what I have seen in reviews. And in January, thanks to a very kind offer from a WAB 'er, I'll get a chance to see that first hand.

The focus "locking up" for a few seconds only happens infrequently and only after I move from something circa 3m away to a much longer distance. I suspect a small software fault. I've tried repeatedly to replicate the fault at the same location as it last happened, but it works perfectly!

I will check through the D7000 manual again to make sure I am using the correct settings, and come back here for any further help arising from that. But from PMG's comments I suspect it is something that is going to happen sometimes for me and a few others at least when photographing any B-I-F at extreme range when it has a similar coloured backrgound. In my case a mix of the Yeti behind the camera not being quite fast enough, and also the lens focussing, especially with the 1.7TC, not being quite fast enough either.

[rogpow]

Originally Posted by KentYeti

But from PMG's comments I suspect it is something that is going to happen sometimes for me and a few others at least when photographing any B-I-F at extreme range when it has a similar coloured backrgound.

Hi Bryan,
As an owl lover I expect you've come across Paul Riddle's website:

owls about that then!

(if not, be prepared to go green with envy. He's located and photographed 200 Little Owl territories in south Leicestershire !)

Anyway, he's recently been photographing SEOs and had similar problems to you (although he's a Canon user). He mentions it in his blog for 31st Oct., and got this comment back:

"Paul, I shouldn't worry to much, of all the owls I have photographed (sadly not many of late) the SOE was the hardest to lock on too. I think it simply blends into the background to much"

So you're not alone!

Think I'll have to have a trip to Sheppey this winter. We get occasional harriers and SEOs here, but not in the numbers you get.

Cheers,
Rog

[Ollie]

Originally Posted by KentYeti

It's not the closer shots where the Owl has some seperation from the background. Where the background in such closer shots tends to be sky, or a bland green field etc.

It's the more distant shots where the Owl is sometimes, but not always, close to the background foliage that at present is quite close to the colour of the Owl. Most of those shots are out of focus, the camera seemingly focussing on the background and not the Owl.

Bryan

Had much the same problems myself last week using the Canon 7D with the 500mm F4 lens. Just a case of there not being enough contrast between bird and background. Poor light has also been an issue for me. This makes it even more difficult for the camera to lock on. Most of the flight shots I have had have been at ISO 1600 or higher and even then the shutter speeds have been too slow really.

[tom w w]

As a Canon user I can't make specifice coments, apart from the obviouse "a canon would do it no problem".

Seriously. On the Canon you can set the priority of focus or burst speed. So if it can't focus it will take a shot anyway OR if it can't focus in time it will wait untill it gets focus. This may be more helpful than my first comment.

This applies to any shot, even single shots, it will either take a shot or wait for focus before taking the shot.

I expect Nikon have something similar.

[KentYeti]

Some very interesting posts above, and one link to a superb web site! Many thanks.

Yes. It's the lack of contrast between the SOE and background that summarises the problem. That's the area I need to focus on, (sorry!), in the Nikon manual to see if there is away round it. I'm not sure there is, but I'll search again.

But in reality, those shots at that distance are not going to be "master shots". But should include more keepers than I've been getting.

I've changed my prime locations as well. That reduces the number of likely shots, but increases the chance of any I do get giving a better result.

Cheers,

Bryan

[Naturenutz]

The last 2 winters i have been using the nikon d300s and nikon 300mm plus 1.4 converter to try and photograph short eared owls at a well known fairly reliable local site(they have just been filming for the one show to be shown later this year but not sure when).I have hundreds of reasonable photographs with slight blur in the wings letting the photo down.The best photos i have were taken on a sunny afternoon recently. Just a little too distant after cropping to be real crackers.i have decided its far better to put in the hours looking for the owls in sunny weather ,rather than easily finding them in poored very late afternoon /evening light which only allows poor shutter speeds.That is my only grumble with this set up,its hard to get fast enough shutter speeds.(best way around it i reckon is too only try in bright sunny conditions.yes you will get many hours with a no show owl but when they do show youl be ready with the correct gear to get great shots.Ps ive had the roaming of the lens when it catches something closer than intended.Annoying as it does usually mean a missed shot as its slow to reset on the intended target but more my fault for not checking the foreground and being prepared.
Not really an answer to your question but my personal experiences with the shorties that might be helpful in some way.
cheers
vic