Unidentified droppings

[RonnieMould]

Hi Kayleigh and thanks. I did wonder about the neighbours having some involvement - as I mentioned it only looked young so find it hard to believe it just dropped dead or that if it was feeling ill it would be wondering the middle of my path next to the lawn right in the open, especially as just a few feet away the bottom of my garden is a mass of undergrowth due to backing onto a stream and a multitude of hiding places. I also hope that they didn't poison it, i personally are not against poisoning rats but I wouldn't try it in my garden due to the other wildlife i know that visits -I see frogs, toads, and hedgehogs...when i'm up early regularly - but i would be offended if they've been aware of them and not said anything. They do have ideal conditions in their garden as it's completely overgrown other than the several piles of logs they have built up for their wood burner.

Werdnal - i'm aware we're rarely far from rats, especially with a stream so close but i do want to try and discourage them from the garden, i like to leave the kitchen door open in summer and would hate to have to stop doing this for fear of them entering the house. The compost is in a sealed bin but they'd dug under the side, not sure what attracted them as - to my knowledge - i haven't put any cooked food or meat scraps in there unless i've got some mixed in by mistake. I'll keep my eyes peeled for any evidence of future visitors though.

[RonnieMould]

...forgot to add, yes I did dispose of the body, just in case.

[Kayleigh]

You mentioned decking this is a classic hiding place for them if I was you I would put some traps down in an in-assessable place under the decking the little snapper type others don't agree with this method but the only other preferred method of eradication would to shoot them and the neighbors might not like this..
You didn't say if you feed the birds if so make sure there is no mess left behind at night..

Elaine

[Hedgehoggy]

Snap traps are indiscriminate, and placed outside in your garden will not just trap the intended targets. Hedgehogs are able to squeeze into incredibly small spaces, and unlike rats, they’re not highly suspicious of anything new – in fact they’re more likely to investigate it as a possible new food source. Hedgehogs will be attracted to the bait used in traps, including chocolate, peanut butter and any other tempting treats.

There have been many reported cases of hedgehogs being caught in rat traps in gardens, and those are just the reported ones. Some hedgehogs have been rescued from the traps while still in-situ, others have been found wandering around with the traps still attached to their (by then infected) limbs, or snout. Some of the injuries are so horrific that most of these cases result in the hedgehog having to be PTS. A hoglet will be killed outright by a rat trap.

It makes me question how many of the presumed ‘dog/fox attack’ cases, where the hedgehogs present with a ‘chewed’ missing limb, are actually the direct consequence of rat traps placed in gardens.

Hedgehog caught in a rat trap | National Anti Snaring Campaign

DISTRICT: Hedgehogs caught in rat traps (From East London and West Essex Guardian Series)

[valleyforge]

Originally Posted by Hedgehoggy

Snap traps are indiscriminate, and placed outside in your garden will not just trap the intended targets.

I entirely agree ... apart from injuring hedgehogs, snap traps (especially the smaller ones) can and do kill shrews and voles ... as well as dunnocks and wrens, which being somewhat mouse-like in their habits will explore every nook, cavity or crawl-space looking for insects.

Please don't ever consider using these devices outdoors.

By the way, looking at the original photo of the supposed rat dropping ... although it's not inconceivable it was deposited by a rat (they usually drop multiple stools at one 'sitting' ... this example could equally have been produced by a weasel or small stoat (which might also explain your dead rat). The appearance of mustelid scat only reflects what the animal last ate ... it doesn't always contain traces of fur or feathers.

[Hedgehoggy]

Originally Posted by valleyforge

By the way, looking at the original photo of the supposed rat dropping ... although it's not inconceivable it was deposited by a rat (they usually drop multiple stools at one 'sitting' ... this example could equally have been produced by a weasel or small stoat (which might also explain your dead rat). The appearance of mustelid scat only reflects what the animal last ate ... it doesn't always contain traces of fur or feathers.

I'm glad you mentioned this first! I thought it looked too moist and smooth to be a rat dropping, especially with there being just the single one, but hey what do I know! As you say, weasel, small stoat (or even hoglet), is conceivable.

[bigdave60dog]

I regularly find dead young rats in the middle of my Garden Path. It`s all down to my big, ginger, Tomcat.
I understand that he also presents them to my neighbours as well. We live a good few hundred miles and sea crossing from you though. I don`t think that even my cat can do that in one night.
Dave

[RonnieMould]

...wow, where to start, so many response since last night.

With regard to the decking, i'm pretty confident rats are not living or moving around under there, the frame for the deck lies directly on top of concrete rather than on stilts. To get underneath the rats would need to chew through the deck planks/frame around the side and would not be able to get more than 18 inches underneath without chewing through the next joist. The is a 3/4 inch gap at the back between the deck and the wall which they could use as a 'rat run' but it wouldn't take them anywhere.

I definitely wouldn't use traps around here (or the rest of the garden) as the area is a favourite dinning haunt of many frogs and at least one hedgehog that regularly come to enjoy the extensive menu of slugs and snails available each evening. The frogs also tend to spend the day hidden in the leaves mentioned above.

I like the sound of the culprit being a stoat or weasel (especially if they're natural rat killers), I didn;t consider animals of this size as assumed the the droppings would be smaller than a rats, however guess the opposite would make sense if they're less numerous. I'd also assume that the area next to the bin (it's against my rear fence which backs onto the bank of a large stream) would be a good habitat for such animals as is dense in undergrowth?

Bigdave - you'll have to give me a description of your cat if the dead rats keep appearing and i'll keep an eye out for him, always been amazed at how far cats get in their travels!!