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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 24-10-2010, 07:41 AM
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Re: Sus scrofa

I am not even sure that population control is possible.

In the Forest of Dean, the Forestry Commission cull is not going very well. At least that was the last that I heard. They were complaining that they didn't have enough rangers and the Boar were still increasing in numbers faster than they could shoot them.

There is a lot of good Boar habitat with no control on place.

My theory on the previous extinction of Wild Boar is simply that it happened because we ate them. With no local supermarket to pop out to a wild pig was a rare prize. I can't see that happening today. Your average "Hubby" is not going to come in from work and then pop down to the local forest for the Sunday Roast.

Locally farmers and land owners do shoot them and there is quite a bit of local poaching but it is not really having much impact on numbers.

I don't think that they will run out of space in the near future and thus become territorially aggressive. They only exist in small pockets at the moment and have the whole of the UK to spread into.

What I do see is that they will extend their range and I think that this is going to happen very rapidly. If two Boar reproduce then you have got six Boar, maybe eight, where's the problem? When two hundred animals reproduce then two thousand is only a few years away.

It seems a bit crazy that in a country where everything is under control we may have to accept this and even modify our behaviour to some extent but I am not sure that this is a bad thing.

I can see three immediate problems.

The Boar will forage on farmland. They can do a great deal of damage in a single night and that is going to really upset some people.

Whilst I do not believe that the Boar pose a real threat to the Human population, people don't handle fear very well. How many Spiders have met an untimely end just before they pounced and sunk their fangs into us, or whatever it is that people think they are going to do. I have heard many stories of people being chased through the woods by aggressive Boar and yet I have never heard of anyone being caught. I suppose that it could be that people are just very good runners.

There is a real threat to our Dogs. It is part of our way of life to take the Dog out to chase Rabbits. That is the right of every Englishman and it is enshrined in our constitution,, I think. That might have to change if there are animals out there that are much bigger than a Dog.

I don't let my German Shepherd chase wild life. He is indiscriminate and would stress and attack animals that may be supporting young. I have trained him to hunt and kill tennis balls, he brings the yellow corpse back to me and we do it again and again. In the park, in the wood he has to be on the lead. Maybe we are going to have to rewrite our constitution.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 24-10-2010, 04:43 PM
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Re: Sus scrofa

Quote:
Originally Posted by STYRBJORN View Post
I'm an Angel. Die!

Just to take one, there is a problem with boar in that they can increase in numbers to the point where they become aggressively territorial
They dont become aggressively territoral when they increase in numbers, females are more aggressive with young, and males are more aggressive when they are breeding. Due to Britain being full of prime habitat and these animals being mobile enough to disperse and the population being at a low level, population size linked to aggression wouldnt be an issue at the moment anyway. They are social and do hold loose territories however these are in no way aggressively defended against other boar. Often they form groups especially during the winter.
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Old 24-10-2010, 04:54 PM
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Re: Sus scrofa

Interesting. Thanks, I had always taken as read that their potential aggression was linked to territory. P'raps they're not like bikers after all! Mind, Angels ride Hogs!

Ric
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old 24-10-2010, 06:56 PM
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Re: Sus scrofa

Not aimed at you (STYRBJORN), but in a general context we have to be careful that we do not control anything for the wrong reasons.
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old 25-10-2010, 05:42 PM
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Re: Sus scrofa

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dogghound View Post
Not aimed at you (STYRBJORN), but in a general context we have to be careful that we do not control anything for the wrong reasons.
I could not agree more. Please excuse me for playing the Devils advocate. To me they are awesome and beautiful animals.

Hey look. A fruitless weekend produced just one decent photo.




fruitless was a pun, a friend of mine has been baiting my cameras with oranges and lemons.

Thanks for your comments.

(Mark if you didn't get my PM call me on esussex.susscrofa@gmail.com It's all good)

Much
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Old 25-10-2010, 07:04 PM
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Re: Sus scrofa

Much - I would like to thank you for your considered response to my query about control, and Dogghound for your sensible comments. As you may know, I am a shooter. If I am asked by a stock farmer to control, ie kill, foxes which are a threat to his lambs or calves, or indeed his free-range chickens, I have no hesitation in getting out to his land with a lamp and a centre-fire rifle.( I will not shoot foxes on arable land.)

Dogghound, I very much take your point about reasons for control. My position might be summarised as Maximising Diversity. Let us keep as many species as possible at a viable level for survival. Where I part company with others on this site is that there are some who seem to think that we should let any species "find its own level" or some such nonsense. Were we to allow wild boar to find their own level we would lose a lot of ground-nesting birds for a start. The crop destruction would be severe, and, trivial as it may appear, people would be scared of these essentially harmless creatures. The result could be persecution, or demonisation, of the species. On the other hand, maintain a viable population, allow shooting for meat, encourage folk to watch them. Treat them rather as we do deer in fact!

Of course, there are a lot of people who don't/won't admit that deer are treated as a resource, and are all the better treated as a result.

Ric
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 25-10-2010, 07:44 PM
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Re: Sus scrofa

The question would be when is the time to control them?

Ten years ago? When we might have been able to stop their re-emergence.

Maybe today? When we can at best restrict the spread. That sounds a little bit elitist to me. In the Forest of Dean the FC are not trying to destroy their Boar. they are just trying to stop them moving into other woodland. They are trying to control the numbers and keep them for themselves, sorry, avoid many of the problems that I have mentioned.

Or maybe at a time when the Boar actually become a problem? That would be a long time from now as there are not really many Boar in Britain. There is room for a lot more before it becomes a problem.

I don't know the answer.

DEFRA are conducting a survey in my wood, among others, to see if Boar activity actually increases biodiversity. Dunno.

Much

(Never trust a man who keeps Pigs)
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 25-10-2010, 08:22 PM
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Re: Sus scrofa

My immediate reaction is that this is the right time to exercise control. I can't agree with you about "elitism". It seems to me that we now have several viable populations of Boar. We do indeed, as you say, live in a controlled "natural" (ho-ho it is to larf) economy. So let us give those populations the greatest freedom we can while limiting their impact on our rural landscape.

Hmm. Just struck me. My last comment there was about as elitist as it gets. Anthropocentrism rules. Or lures.

Ric
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