scratch and sniff id guide required

[Jo Pedder]

Hi guys - advice from mammal lovers please.

I've got myself all confused on badger and fox odour.

The literature talks about being able to distinguish from badger setts and fox earths (or at least tell you if a fox is in a sett) from the pungent musky odour that foxes produce.

However, badgers are mustelids and should also be leaving a musky odour too. There is a distinctive whiff that I often pick up when out and about - some times just along tracks, but usually coming from sett/earths. I wouldn't call the smell that I'm familiar with a pungent odour - it's almost pleasant, a kind if sweet sickly composty smell.

Am I sniffing foxes or badgers?

It would be great if Collins could add to their excellent range of field guides with a scratch and sniff version - otter spraint vs mink scat. Red squirrel vs grey.

Can any one help, or does anyone else have any other tips with odour related field skills?

Thanks,

Jo

[Jo Pedder]

no one have any idea?

[Alan]

Jo, it’s sometimes difficult to determine whether the odour you’re taking of is fox or badger. So it’s best to try to piece a few bits of information together.

Foxes usually leave their signs at prominent places like gates, hedge gaps and the start of paths. The urine has a pungent smell; some people even say it resembles stale coffee!

Badgers usually defecate and urinate in small pits, or dung pits. You’ll usually find a few of these together. It’s a sort of communal toilet!

The difference between a badger set and a fox earth are usually quite easy to spot. Fox earths usually only have one or two entrances and the inside, in the breeding season, is usually littered with animal remains. Foxes aren’t very good housekeepers! They usually change earths on a regular bases. Foxes also only use earths in the breeding season, and much prefere to sleep out in the open in hedge bottoms etc.

A badger sett will usually be a series of well dugout holes with large spoil heaps. Often there will be remains of straw/hay outside certain entrances. Badgers are very fastidious about keeping their sett tidy and clean! Many setts have been recorded as being in continual use for decades and much more!

The scent of a badger has a rather pleasing (to my nose anyway!) musky smell, which is often described as being sickly sweet. If you’ve ever handled ferrets, the smell is very similar.

Hope this helps.

[henrya]

I have a book somewhere that suggests that the hole of a Fox earth is an upright oval, whilst the hole of a Badger sett is a horizontal oval. Make sense in terms of the shape of the beasts, but I doubt it's as clear cut as that. I'll try and find the reference over the weekend.

A friend and I once stopped and picked up a dead Badger thaat had just been RTAed (the culpriy was still there). My friend put it in the boot of his car and said he'd take it to MAFF the next morning. He told me later that the smell in his car the next morning was quite overpowering and not pleasant - so not everyone agrees with Alan.

henrya

[Alan]

Originally Posted by henrya

I have a book somewhere that suggests that the hole of a Fox earth is an upright oval, whilst the hole of a Badger sett is a horizontal oval. Make sense in terms of the shape of the beasts, but I doubt it's as clear cut as that. I'll try and find the reference over the weekend.

A friend and I once stopped and picked up a dead Badger thaat had just been RTAed (the culpriy was still there). My friend put it in the boot of his car and said he'd take it to MAFF the next morning. He told me later that the smell in his car the next morning was quite overpowering and not pleasant - so not everyone agrees with Alan.

henrya

Yes badger holes are often wider than they are heigh.

Well yes depending on the time of year I guess they can be a bit smellier, especially the bores.

Lol.....Also I'm half mustelid on my fathers side Henry......so that could explain my taste

[hachidori]

Originally Posted by Jo Pedder

I wouldn't call the smell that I'm familiar with a pungent odour - it's almost pleasant, a kind if sweet sickly composty smell.

Am I sniffing foxes or badgers?

I would say that a sweet smell, in my experience, is quite a "badgery" (is that a word? ) thing. I have always told people that badger smell is pleasant, fox smell is quite pungent and unpleasant. Also, the size / shape of setts is not a definite way to determine presence of one animal or another, as foxes will readily inhabit disused badger setts. Footprints and fur in the entrance are ways to tell. Fox footprints look like very neat dog prints, while badger prints are very "teddy bear-ish", usally showing all five toes at the front of a large oval pad.

[Alan]

Originally Posted by hachidori

I would say that a sweet smell, in my experience, is quite a "badgery" (is that a word? ) thing. I have always told people that badger smell is pleasant, fox smell is quite pungent and unpleasant. Also, the size / shape of setts is not a definite way to determine presence of one animal or another, as foxes will readily inhabit disused badger setts. Footprints and fur in the entrance are ways to tell. Fox footprints look like very neat dog prints, while badger prints are very "teddy bear-ish", usally showing all five toes at the front of a large oval pad.

Hi hachidori, and welcome to the forum

Yeah I agree with you on that, and as I said earlier - you need to piece a few bits of info together. Once you know the signs though, it's quite easy to tell the difference isn't it?

[nightshade]

I remember meeting a man who had been walking his dog,he was holding the faithful dog at
a distance with his walking stick, the poor dog used to walking at heel could not understand
what it had done wrong.
Apparently the dog had suprised a fox and during a rough and tumble fight had taken on the foxy odour (he actually said the fox had peed on the dog) as I recall the smell was sweet like tom cats piddle but musky as well and cloying

[Alan]

Originally Posted by nightshade

I remember meeting a man who had been walking his dog,he was holding the faithful dog at
a distance with his walking stick, the poor dog used to walking at heel could not understand
what it had done wrong.
Apparently the dog had suprised a fox and during a rough and tumble fight had taken on the foxy odour (he actually said the fox had peed on the dog) as I recall the smell was sweet like tom cats piddle but musky as well and cloying

It's worth noting that the scent a mammal such as fox or stoat gives off when it's frightened or distressed, is far stronger or bitter than it's normal smell/scent! Think of Skunks!

[Jo Pedder]

thanks guys,

yo are right that it's a case of putting all the info together, it's just that hairs are not always a good indicator of a setts current occupant and where there are no prints the smell should be really useful. I think that I've been correct in the assumptions I've been making as although not every agrees that badgers smell nice, fox definitely do not - and I've often found a pleasant sweet smell from some setts and have assumed that the current resident was actually badger, rather than a fox.