Two oil beetles for ID please

[Lucy T]

Two oil beetles, one pic taken recently in Devon, the other in Cornwall.

I can't tell if they're M proscarabaeus or M violaceus.... or M rugosus.

[Geoff F]

I would say M. proscarabaeus for the second but I'm not too sure about the first; it appears to have something of a greenish tinge which might suggest M. variegatus. This however is a rather uncommon species.

'Availability' of these other species is a bit uncertain, and my literature is somewhat sparse on this family so I think this is one for the beetle experts.

I keep looking in the areas around S. Devon where I have previously found them but no success so far this year. Perhaps this spell of rain will help.

ps. I knew I had something about this family bookmarked

http://www.buglife.org.uk/getinvolve...+Photo+Gallery

But it doesn't add a lot with regards to firm identification.

This is the page for which I was searching

http://www.buglife.org.uk/getinvolve...nt+-+Get+ready

[Klaas Reißmann]

Hi there,

when you take a look at the antennae you notice it must be two females of subgenus Proscarabaeus. Both are Meloe violaceus, as the dotting of head and thorax shows, and also the form of the thorax in the first picture (can't be seen in the second).

Regards
Klaas

[Lucy T]

Thanks both for your comments.

Klaas, please could you explain to me a little more, because I thought the Meloe Proscarabaeus and Meloe violaceus were two different beetles.

Saw another oil beetle in Devon yesterday. This one was even brighter in colour than the image below. Is this a Meloe violaceus?

[Klaas Reißmann]

Hi Lucy,

no problem. You thought right. Meloe proscarabaeus and Meloe violaceus are two different species. To understand what I wrote the following explanations:

A genus can be devided into two or more subgenuses. In Centaleurope the genus Meloe includes six different subgenuses, which are:

Lampromeloe
Eurymeloe
Coelomeloe
Listromeloe
Micromeloe
Proscarabaeus

The subgenus Proscarabaeus in Centraleurope consists of at least three species, which are:

Meloe violaceus
Meloe proscarabaeus
Meloe autumnalis

You can write it in the following way to make clear, that they all are of the same subgenus:

Meloe (Proscarabaeus) violaceus
Meloe (Proscarabaeus) proscarabaeus
Meloe (Proscarabaeus) autumnalis

The attribute making those three species dedicated to subgenus Proscarabaeus are the limbs of the antennae. Meloe has got 11 limbs in each antennae. The first limb and the last four limbs of their antennae are of "normal" size, remarkable smaller than the limbs inbetween. The second limb up to the seventh limb are by far more broad than the others. Limb six and seven in the male antennae is flatened and bended, which can be seen very well (take a look at pictures). This can be only seen in the Meloe of the subgenus Proscarabaeus. Take a look at yours you have taken the photographs of and you can see, that the middle limbs are much more broad and bigger than the others. Can be well seen in contrast to the last four limbs.

If there are any questions don't hasitate to ask. And sorry if I gave a bad explanation.

Regards
Klaas

Edit: The Meloe in your last picture is a Meloe violaceus, male.

[Jim Ford]

Does anyone know if they're to be found in the Chilterns? I've had a google, but not come up with anything/

For me they're an iconic insect. I remember reading about them when I was a boy and being fascinated. I've never seen one though.

Jim

[Matt Smith]

Meloe rugosus has been recorded at the BBOWT Warburg Reserve and the Hartslock Reserve, both in the Chilterns. I've not seen the adults myself but I do have bee specimens from Warburg with tringulin larvae attached, I presume these are M.rugosus.

[Lucy T]

Klaas, thanks so much for your in depth reply. That should help me to identify M. Proscarabaus & M. violaceus from now on - fingers crossed!

Came across another oil beetle today, that is different from the other two. Could it be a Meloe Rugosus?

I was dead when I found it - hopefully I spot a live one at some point!

[Lucy T]

Rather embarrassing typo in the previous post! I meant: "It was dead when I found it".

The beetle hadn't been trodden on, so possibly the cause was from a glancing blow e.g. from a pebble, or it was just the natural end of its life.

The location of this sighting is south devon, just east of Plymouth.

[Geoff F]

And I found my first one today, Lucy, and that was east of Plymouth as well (around 15 miles).

I can't quite make out the appropriate areas on those photos but the base of the thorax appears to be slightly curved like M. violaceus and the antennae seem to be kinked. It has probably lost a bit of colour due to being dead!

I haven't tried to ID mine yet but it did superficially look like M. violaceus.