Help identifying small white fly please (Staffs area)

[Phil Whiley]

I'm having difficulty identifying a small white fly that landed on our kitchen window a few days ago, although it's quite distinctive. Length was about 4-5mm. Can anyone help please?
Thanks
Phil

[JRsbugs]

It's in the family Chironomidae, female I think as it doesn't have feathery antennae but couldn't say that for sure as there's a lot of them. (It could be a male from the shape of the tail end, the antennae are not always so feathery)

If you look carefully it does have brown streaks on the thorax, and the abdomen could be pale green, this is a form I get.

Janet

[Jason Green]

Afternoon Phil,

It's a Chironomous Midge (Non-biting!), but impossible to identify unfortunately (this being a girl!) - though it does have a look of Tanytarsus sp.

A revised UK key was published a while back detailing something like 400+ species. A snip at just... £53!

Take care,

Jason

[JRsbugs]

I wouldn't venture to say Tanytarsus sp. There are many which can be confusing.

Midge - BugGuide.Net

To get an idea, take a look at these..

Family Chironomidae - Midges - BugGuide.Net

[Jason Green]

There certainly are! I only said 'A look of', though. The wing venation appears to lack the usual crossvein, and the tibia is actually about the same size as the tarsus - which points to Orthocladiinae of which Tantytarsus is a member. The luminous-looking general colouration appears to be like this genus - though I should have said 'group' and of course there are several closely-related as you intermate.

The female genitalia is visible too, so species-level work with male genitals (very likely to be needed when you have a specimen!) is out of the question. Male genitals should be like two self-facing hooks and hers as you can see are two nodes. These may be needed with some, but I can't be certain which one it is I seem to remember!

[JRsbugs]

Originally Posted by Jason Green

There certainly are! I only said 'A look of', though. The wing venation appears to lack the usual crossvein, and the tibia is actually about the same size as the tarsus - which points to Orthocladiinae of which Tantytarsus is a member. The luminous-looking general colouration appears to be like this genus - though I should have said 'group' and of course there are several closely-related as you intermate.

The female genitalia is visible too, so species-level work with male genitals (very likely to be needed when you have a specimen!) is out of the question. Male genitals should be like two self-facing hooks and hers as you can see are two nodes. These may be needed with some, but I can't be certain which one it is I seem to remember!

Any more than Genus Dicrotendipes in the Chironomus group? I wouldn't even like to suggest that.

Midge - Dicrotendipes - BugGuide.Net

I don't see how you can see the 'female genitalia'. The antennae are not sufficiently focused either to tell.

[JRsbugs]

Just to show how variable in shape the male genitalia is, look at this one..not "like two self-facing hooks"

Tail - Polypedilum - BugGuide.Net

[Jason Green]

Originally Posted by JRsbugs

I don't see how you can see the 'female genitalia'. The antennae are not sufficiently focused either to tell.

Male: http://bugguide.net/images/cache/J0W...C0PQV0EQPK.jpg

Male genitalia: http://bugguide.net/images/raw/8Z0LP...NZ8L9Z4LZR.jpg

At this distance you'd have pretty good DoF, and so I doubt the antennae are out of it. That said, looking at the stem it seems too thick to support the plumose hairs too - so female in my opinion, on both counts.

I wasn't suggesting Tantytarsus - I said it has the look of. The look which may be evident with with others in the Orthocladiinae sub., so should probably have said that.

[Jason Green]

Originally Posted by JRsbugs

Just to show how variable in shape the male genitalia is, look at this one..not "like two self-facing hooks"]

Not in all instances, no - but I have more experience with that in Chironominae than Orthocladiinae which may differ.

The shape of the terminal structure of Phil's fly isn't what I'd expect to see in a male - it lacks any provision for the more unique internal structure that is so important in identifying these to species-level microscopically. You'll see this when you compare your last image to his.

[JRsbugs]

Jason, I think what I am trying to say here is that these are difficult even for experts, and the pic really isn't good enough to say a lot.

It does look like a female though, but not knowing where it belongs is too risky to say even that.