hairy cat / yellow lacewing?

[diggleken]

Hi all, any help with these two much appreciated.................
this first was found on an old stump in upland peaty heathery pennine area , possibly dead, didnt move! about 1'' long only, one of the Eggars?

Then this, what appears to be a Lacewing, but quite small, about half an inch or so long, so I thought some Chrysoperla spp with colour changing towards brown as its quite yellow, but its far too small?

Thanks a lot
Ken

[Geoff F]

Don't take too much notice of this as I know very little about Lacewings and their relatives. But that does look a bit like Micromus angulatus; or a 'close friend'.

Size and time of year fit.

[diggleken]

Thanks Geoff, I saw that but for some reason dismissed it - it does look close with a slightly different veination pattern , but that varies a bit I gather, is that right?
Caterpillar still anyone?
Cheers
Ken

[squishy]

I'd take a wild stab at some kind of tiger moth.

[k4t3]

Looks like a shrivelled up Oak Eggar caterpillar in my inexpert eyes! Only because this species overwinters as a caterpillar and it looks like some that I tried to keep in hibernation (unsuccessfully) the other year

[diggleken]

Thanks for views everyone - I did consider woolly bears, tiger moths, but it seemed small and the habitat isnt right I dont think - but they do overwinter.....................mmmhhhh.
But Eggar is much better for that habitat and I gather the larvae overwinter as k4t3 says too, get bigger and emerge in spring - so it could be a small oak eggar that maybe got caught out in the deep frost a few weeks ago after it ''woke up'' and then died.
I have a vision of it crawling high for the last rays of the sun to warm it up and they never came, awwwwwhh!
Any other ideas?
Cheers
Ken

[Geoff F]

The FSC have an identification guide for Lacewings, and close relatives, in their Aidgap series; but identification eventually comes down to counting the wing veins. Although you might get to family level reasonably easily.

I do have that publication but can't clearly make out the required veins, although you might have better luck working from an enlargement of the original image.

To narrow down the options, would you describe the fly colour as yellowish green or brownish?

If brownish, it may be worth considering Micromus paganus or one of the Hemerobius species. Also, because of the smallish size, the Sympherobius family may also be possible.

Although I do have this one publication, I am still a total novice with this general family, so perhaps somebody more experienced will be able to help.

[diggleken]

Originally Posted by Geoff F

The FSC have an identification guide for Lacewings, and close relatives, in their Aidgap series; but identification eventually comes down to counting the wing veins. Although you might get to family level reasonably easily.

I do have that publication but can't clearly make out the required veins, although you might have better luck working from an enlargement of the original image.

To narrow down the options, would you describe the fly colour as yellowish green or brownish?

If brownish, it may be worth considering Micromus paganus or one of the Hemerobius species. Also, because of the smallish size, the Sympherobius family may also be possible.

Although I do have this one publication, I am still a total novice with this general family, so perhaps somebody more experienced will be able to help.

Hi Geoff, it was a pale yellow colour, if it was going to change, more likely brown I would imagine, but not showing any clear tendency to green or brown really, sorry!
I do have a couple more pics at home so will try counting the wing veins if I can - what do I need to actually count - direction, length, those branching, those parallel to edge and so on?
That said, the wings seemed more dotted than veined.
Sorry, this probably doesnt help much.
later.........Collins (chinery) insects of britain has some info on veins, so I'll have a go using that!
Cheers
Ken

[diggleken]

well, its starting to look like Micromus variegatus, following the vein structure and images on the web, but still seems a bit yellowish, but happy with that, its a lovely thing - wish I'd put it in the greenhouse to have a go at the aphids............
Cheers all
Ken

[Geoff F]

Following those veins can be complicated, Ken. The easiest answer is to fork out seven pounds for the Aidgap key.

But basically, very basically. There should be a distinctive vein running the full length of the wing and close to the leading edge. The cross veins radiating forwards from this vein should have forked ends. That will mean that you have the correct general family.

If it is Micromus sp. there will be some smaller veins running diagonally from this distinctive vein to the outer lower wing edge. We are talking about veins which branch from the main vein around the middle of the wing length and do not fork until approaching the wing edge. There will be short cross veins joining these diagonal veins together.

Ignore earlier veins which soon fork or any which do not run, approximately, parallel to each other.

Micromus variegatus should have 3 diagonal veins; M. angulatus has 4 and M. paganus has 5.

Hope this makes some sense.