Help identify droppings please!!

[mh68]

Just had another close look at the images. On the pics, the dropping on the far right looks as though its been trampled/walked over(the left hand end of the dropping is squashed),which would rule out Henry`s suggestion if this is the case.
The apparent pool of urine accompanying the droppings sounds right for Rat.Shame there are no signs of footprints present after whatever it was had trodden through the urine/droppings, that would help.
Might be worth putting something down to try and capture some tracks - maybe a little bit of flour or similar that would adhere to the feet and leave some marks as the animal moved around???

Mark H

[Dogghound]

I agree with the rat they are to large for the other small mammals. Plus look like rat, the pool of urine around them also sugests rats.

[thunder]

The droppings are in a very strange place - right in the angle of the wall like that. I can't quite see how a rat would get them there.

henrya

[Dogghound]

Rats tend to stick to the edges of rooms, whilst doing this they develop routes in which other rats follow its common for rats to leave odour trails of urine and genital secretions along these tracks for others to follow (as well as tell the status of other rats in the area) so them being so far against the wall isnt to strange. The urine rules out slugs etc, the droppings and location rules out toads/frogs etc, the size (Brown rat 15-20mm long av.) compared to (house mouse 3-5mm av), (wood mouse 5-7mm av). There is simply nothing else it could be im afraid.

[thunder]

Originally Posted by Dogghound

Rats tend to stick to the edges of rooms, whilst doing this they develop routes in which other rats follow its common for rats to leave odour trails of urine and genital secretions along these tracks for others to follow (as well as tell the status of other rats in the area) so them being so far against the wall isnt to strange. The urine rules out slugs etc, the droppings and location rules out toads/frogs etc, the size (Brown rat 15-20mm long av.) compared to (house mouse 3-5mm av), (wood mouse 5-7mm av). There is simply nothing else it could be im afraid.

Afraid I disagree with you on most of those points - but especially that the droppings look nothing like the droppings that 'my' rats leave. Why does the location rule out frogs and toads, and not rats? They are right in the angle of floor and wall, as far as I can tell.

henrya

[Dogghound]

Location - Rats often live in buildings amphibians dont, In the angle why does that mean its not a rat? Im unaware of frogs and toads leaving pools of urine around droppings? Im sure you appreciate that droppings vary on diet, so its highly likely that these rats in a different location with different factors affecting diet produce different droppings to your rats. What other else do you disagree with?

[djackso]

Rat droppings are notoriously variable. I don't think rat can yet be ruled out
Can anyone find a picture of a frog dropping - I cannot?

I also favour rat because they are fast - if they hear you coming they move like grease lightning, usually out of sight and upwards. You would most likely have spotted an amphibian in your kitchen.

[mh68]

Originally Posted by djackso

Rat droppings are notoriously variable. I don't think rat can yet be ruled out
Can anyone find a picture of a frog dropping - I cannot.

I also favour rat because they are fast - if they hear you coming they move like grease lightning, usually out of sight and upwards. You would most likely have spotted an amphibian in your kitchen.

I tried to find examples of Amphibian droppings, but found zilch. My books have very sparse info too which wasnt of any use.Until I can find anything useful, I`ll still go with Rat.

Mark H

[thunder]

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Location - Rats often live in buildings amphibians dont,
Endquote

Toads are frequently found in buildings

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In the angle why does that mean its not a rat?
Endquote

How would it get the dropping right in the angle? One leg halfway up the wall?

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Im unaware of frogs and toads leaving pools of urine around droppings?
Endquote

Also I'm unaware of rats leaving dropping in pools of urine.

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Im sure you appreciate that droppings vary on diet, so its highly likely that these rats in a different location with different factors affecting diet produce different droppings to your rats.
Endquote

I appreciate that - but I've never seen rat droppings looking anything like those in the picture

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What other else do you disagree with?
Endquote

Not sure the liquid (not proved to be urine), rules out slugs and snails.

But I think we need more evidence before we say for certain who made these droppings, so I'm quite happy to leave them "unidentified" until we have more information.

henrya

[mh68]

Originally Posted by thunder

But I think we need more evidence before we say for certain who made these droppings, so I'm quite happy to leave them "unidentified" until we have more information.

henrya

Yep agree with that Henry, hence my suggestion of trying to put something down to get some prints (if indeed the creature has feet ).Up til now all we can do is make educated guesses as to what it may be, without any certainty.

Mark H