Black asco on pallet

[flaxton]

Can anyone shed light on this asco found on a pallet being used for holding in my compost heap.
Small (for most of us) at 1/2mm dark grey in the centre black on the outside covered with black hairs.



My first thought was Trichohpaeopsis bicuspis but with these long thin allantoid spores (some septate) that was soon ruled out.


Thanks
Mal

[diggleken]

Hi Mal,
havent a clue, but this thread may be useful, perhaps a Pirottaea spp, which appear to be host specific from what Chris and Andreas say?
Micro fungi
Andreas 16/7/11 post and pic maybe?
Cheers
Ken

[mollisia]

Hello,

hähähä, there you were put
This is no ascomycete, but an imperfect fungus. You haven't seen asci, have you?
I think it is Pseudolachnea hispidula. But I think there is another imperfect species which looks alike. I think the spores a differenciating them, but am not sure. Chris surely will know

best regards,
Andreas

[Chris Yeates]

Actually Andreas, this is an ascomycete of course! however I know what you mean. I would totally agree with Pseudolachnea hispidula - the conidia look rather young but some are clearly 1-septate and have terminal setulae at each end

the taxonomic position of this anamorphic ascomycete is still, it would appear, uncertain - without even being placed in an order (surely it's been sequenced?); so "incertae sedis" it remains pro tem . . . .

the British distribution seems centred on Yorkshire, Mal: NBN Gateway: Pseudolachnea hispidula grid map can't for the life of me think why . . .

cheers

Chris

[flaxton]

Originally Posted by mollisia

Hello,

hähähä, there you were put
This is no ascomycete, but an imperfect fungus. You haven't seen asci, have you?
I think it is Pseudolachnea hispidula. But I think there is another imperfect species which looks alike. I think the spores a differenciating them, but am not sure. Chris surely will know

best regards,
Andreas

No asci but the rest looks spot on thank for that.

Originally Posted by Chris Yeates

the British distribution seems centred on Yorkshire, Mal: NBN Gateway: Pseudolachnea hispidula grid map can't for the life of me think why . . .

cheers

Chris

There does seem to be a preponderance of finds down to one individual. Good to be in such august company

Mal

[mollisia]

Hello,

Originally Posted by Chris Yeates

Actually Andreas, this is an ascomycete of course!

of course, shame on me

best regards,
Andreas

[fairplay]

Chris,

In his booklet 'Fungi & Slime Moulds in Suffolk' Martin Ellis places his record for P.hispidula under the old order of 'Deuteromycetes' which I have crossed off and entered 'Mitosporic Fungi' but can this record now safely be placed under 'Ascomycetes' if it is an ascomycete ?

As I understand it, no 'perfect' state (with asci present) has been found yet, so are you saying it should remain as a Mitosporic fungus ? (incertae sedis means 'uncertain' I guess) or has the word Mitosporic also been abandoned now ?

Neil.

[Chris Yeates]

Originally Posted by fairplay

Chris,

In his booklet 'Fungi & Slime Moulds in Suffolk' Martin Ellis places his record for P.hispidula under the old order of 'Deuteromycetes' which I have crossed off and entered 'Mitosporic Fungi' but can this record now safely be placed under 'Ascomycetes' if it is an ascomycete ?

As I understand it, no 'perfect' state (with asci present) has been found yet, so are you saying it should remain as a Mitosporic fungus ? (incertae sedis means 'uncertain' I guess) or has the word Mitosporic also been abandoned now ?

Neil.

You raise a number of questions here Neil and I feel duty-bound to keep it simple . . . . essentially the vast majority of the fungi once classed as Deuteromycetes (a convenient but phylogenetically meaningless group name - like 'Gasteromycetes') are the asexual stages of ascomycete fungi; in some cases we know the perfect "sexual" stage; in others that stage remains to be found; and in yet others that stage has been lost, because the fungus can function perfectly well without that stage

DNA sequencing means that a lot of these anamorphic fungi can now be placed within the vast framework which is the Ascomycota, others can't or haven't yet been so disposed; "incertae sedis" literally means "uncertain where it sits"

again it all boils down to what you call things in what circumstances; informally - on a foray or on a forum like this - we can call butter cap Collybia butyracea; we can say that Lycoperdon perlatum is a gasteromycete; we can treat slime moulds and downy mildews as fungi; we can - and I often do - talk of Coelomycetes and Hyphomycetes; but we must remember that this is done within an informal context - if one were to publish a scientific paper such convenient but loose terms wouldn't do

and no the word "mitosporic" - as a synonym for "anamorphic" - is fine we would know what you meant

cheers

Chris

[fairplay]

I can actually understand that - right then ... I'm off to bed.

Cheers Chris,

Neil.

[watsthat]

Nice explanation Chris; I understood it, thanks to your simplified presentation, but I wouldn`t want to answer any questions on it in 5 minutes time

Pete