Melanoleuca confirmation please

[watsthat]

Hi all

I know this specimen is a bit past its sell-by but would I be far off the mark with Melanoleuca polioleuca?






Cheers

Pete

[NickCantle]

I just took ages writing my reply and then it was invalid because someone deleted the post I was editing

ANYWAY!

First off, there are a couple of things that I think point away from Melanoleuca. For starters, Melanoleuca generally have quite a 'woody' and slimline appearance to the stipe whereas yours is quite chunky and substantial. Secondly, the pileus has a very striate margin, which I really wouldn't expect to see in this genus. If I had to make an educated guess from the cap photo alone, I think most people here, including myself, would suggest Amanita. If I did suspect Amanita, then I would expect it to be part of the A. Spissa/Excelsa and Rubescens circle, but upon inspection of the underside, no bruising of colour change is evident. Regardless, the gills aren't right for Amanita. The thing to me that would point towards your suspected species is the shiny and umbonate middle to the cap, but I'm pretty clueless.

Thought you might value my deductions, even without conclusion

Nick

EDIT; I'm not suggesting this is an Amanita

[FungiJohn]

Originally Posted by NickCantle

I just took ages writing my reply and then it was invalid because someone deleted the post I was editing

Yes, I did Nick ... trust you to edit the wrong one

John

[watsthat]

Originally Posted by NickCantle

I just took ages writing my reply and then it was invalid because someone deleted the post I was editing

ANYWAY!

First off, there are a couple of things that I think point away from Melanoleuca. For starters, Melanoleuca generally have quite a 'woody' and slimline appearance to the stipe whereas yours is quite chunky and substantial. Secondly, the pileus has a very striate margin, which I really wouldn't expect to see in this genus. If I had to make an educated guess from the cap photo alone, I think most people here, including myself, would suggest Amanita. If I did suspect Amanita, then I would expect it to be part of the A. Spissa/Excelsa and Rubescens circle, but upon inspection of the underside, no bruising of colour change is evident. Regardless, the gills aren't right for Amanita. The thing to me that would point towards your suspected species is the shiny and umbonate middle to the cap, but I'm pretty clueless.

Thought you might value my deductions, even without conclusion

Nick

EDIT; I'm not suggesting this is an Amanita

Well thanks for going to such a lot of trouble Nick. It was my fault originally for forgetting to paste the pics. Re your deductions; I did consider Amanita possibly A. vaginata but that`s as far as I got.

Cheers

Pete

[mollisia]

Hallo,

It is a Amanita, I agree, and without doubt.
On the first look it seems to be a "Amanitopsis", and there it might be either ceciliae/inaurata with the flocks washed away (because of the grey stipe) or something from the lividopallescens group. But on 2nd look it reminds me of a collection of Amanita eliae which looked astongishingly similar.
But as we have no stipe base it will never be possible to say definitively.
The species of Amanita subgenus Amanitopsis have increased dramatically in the last years and the way of determinations has changed also. The investigation of the gills trama is very important (cells and size of the subhymenial layer e.g.), clamp connections, etc.. There are about 40 of those species in Europe, and especially the brown ones (lividopallescens-group) and the silvery-grey ones (mairei-group) have a lot of species now.

My favorite is a weathered specimen of Amanita ceciliae.

her for comparism a picture ofA. ceciliae in about the age your fungus is:



and her the picture of Amanita eliae, which looks also quite similar to your finding (sorry for the quality ...):



best regards,
Andreas

[KeenTeen17]

just a question Andreas:
Does "opsis" in the Latin Name mean "looks like?"

for example hygrophora and hygrophoropsis?


thanks

[watsthat]

Thanks to everyone. I`m humbled by the effort and vast detail provided. It gives me something to chew on. I will certainly be looking out this year, in the same spot, to see if they re-appear and hopefully obtain more diagnostic information.

Cheers

Pete

[mollisia]

Originally Posted by KeenTeen17

just a question Andreas:
Does "opsis" in the Latin Name mean "looks like?"

for example hygrophora and hygrophoropsis?


thanks

Hallo KT,

I don't know the exact meaning and am too lazy to search my dictionary. But it has a kind of this meaning, may be more like "similar to", what not necessarily means that they look very similar. But usually the genus with "-opsis" was formerly included in the genus with the basic name and has been separated for some reasons.
You have this kind of ending quite often in all orders of fungi.
Tricholoma - Tricholomopsis
Ceriporia - Ceriporiopsis
Mollisia - Mollisiopsis (which are not very near relativs, b.t.w.)

best regards,
Andreas

[Chris Yeates]

Originally Posted by KeenTeen17

just a question Andreas:
Does "opsis" in the Latin Name mean "looks like?"

for example hygrophora and hygrophoropsis?


thanks

hi KT

yes it does - not Latin but Latinized Greek from the word Ops meaning an eye (the root of the words 'optical', 'optician' etc.)

so it literally means 'to the eye' or presumably something like 'at first glance'

you get it in other groups as well - think of the Welsh poppy genus Meconopsis

cheers

Chris