Peziza and Laccaria

[flaxton]

Two more for identification or at least pointers please.
The first one is a pale peziza with a small stipe(is it still called a stipe on something like this) growing alongside a piece of wood but not attached as far as I could see. Spores up to 21 x 11.




The second is a Laccaria (two spored variety). It was growing on the bare soil under a couple of trees one fagus. The spores were globose and that led me to tortillis but never having seen it before and the fact that it doesn't look much like any photos I can find


Thanks

Mal

[CapAndBracket]

The spore size for the cup fungi fit with Tarzetta catinus (so maybe).

Cheers J.P.

[CapAndBracket]

In Jordan, L.fraterna is listed as Basidia 2 spored (spores sub-spherical)
and the photo looks like yours, but i will get no prizes for just going on a photo, this species dosen't appear in phillips so no cross reference.

Cheers J.P.

[mykonik]

Originally Posted by flaxton

Two more for identification or at least pointers please.
The first one is a pale peziza with a small stipe(is it still called a stipe on something like this) growing alongside a piece of wood but not attached as far as I could see. Spores up to 21 x 11.




The second is a Laccaria (two spored variety). It was growing on the bare soil under a couple of trees one fagus. The spores were globose and that led me to tortillis but never having seen it before and the fact that it doesn't look much like any photos I can find


Thanks

Mal

Hi Mal,

JP is probably correct with the Tarzetta diagnosis, but whether or not T. catinus ??

The Laccaria - if L. tortilis would be easy to diagnosis - the spores of this species are large (comparatively !) for the genus - averagely about 11 - 16 mu, possibly a bit larger !

I have to say that your photo doesn't appear to be of L. tortilis but who knows - see what the spores say !

Nick

[flaxton]

The spores on the tarzetta are all in the region of 11-12 mu wide so I feel fairly confident that it is not cupularis but without microscopic details of other Tarzetta I will go for catinus

Will look at the Laccaria spores

Mal

[mykonik]

Originally Posted by flaxton

The spores on the tarzetta are all in the region of 11-12 mu wide so I feel fairly confident that it is not cupularis but without microscopic details of other Tarzetta I will go for catinus

Will look at the Laccaria spores

Mal

I think that would be the right diagnosis !

Spores of T. catinus are (average) 20 - 24 x 11 - 13mu - your previous measurements fitted the length - and latterly the breadth ! And the photo looks like T. catinus !

Nick

[Andy Overall]

Originally Posted by mykonik

I think that would be the right diagnosis !

Spores of T. catinus are (average) 20 - 24 x 11 - 13mu - your previous measurements fitted the length - and latterly the breadth ! And the photo looks like T. catinus !

Nick

I had T. catinus from Hampstead Heath last year, following very wet weather, I must say it looked very much like the species in the picture from Mal.

Andy

[flaxton]

Originally Posted by mykonik

Hi Mal,


The Laccaria - if L. tortilis would be easy to diagnosis - the spores of this species are large (comparatively !) for the genus - averagely about 11 - 16 mu, possibly a bit larger !

I have to say that your photo doesn't appear to be of L. tortilis but who knows - see what the spores say !

Nick

The spores say it is not tortilis the average is 9. That means it could be fraterna but it is quite rare. I then went to the Checklist and found that it always found with Eucalyptus and guess what there is at least one such tree close by.
Is this another for Kew

Mal

[flaxton]

Nick
How come all the books say fraterna is found under "BL" trees or Salix or damp areas and yet the Checklist says ALWAYS found with Eucalyptus

Mal

[mykonik]

Originally Posted by flaxton

Nick
How come all the books say fraterna is found under "BL" trees or Salix or damp areas and yet the Checklist says ALWAYS found with Eucalyptus

Mal

I have to admit that I don't really know the answer to this question Mal - but the 'popular' books are wrong - the Checklist is right (the records / comments within it, having been taken from the material (evidence) in Herb. Kew !).

Also, the taxonomy of Laccaria species has really only been looked at properly during the last few years and habitat information may be due to this species (L. fraterna) having being mistaken for some other bisporic Laccaria.

But even that is a bit tenuous since there are very few bisporic species in Britain AND it is more than likely that L. fraterna is an 'introduction' into this country since it is always found with Eucalyptus and occurs in Australia where that tree is native !

And, yes, it might be worth sending the material to Kew (with the association with Eucalyptus noted !) since I can't find any records of it from your neck of the woods - mostly recorded from south, south-eastern and south- western England by the look of it !

This is something WAB members could helpfully look out for - two spored Laccaria, associated with Eucalyptus !

Nick