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| 1 | 2 | 3 |  » Stats |
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Top Poster: glsammy (14,777)
| | Welcome to our newest member, bryan 1 | |  | | 
10-06-2008, 03:13 PM
|  | Knight of the Wild Empire | | Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Sheffield
Posts: 8,627
| | | Pluteus under Limes
Here's another two from Lime Tree Avenue
I'm assuming the first species is Pluteus sp. (found on wood litter debris) and the second species is Panaeolus sp. (in grass) ... But then I know I should never assume anything in this game   
John  |
10-06-2008, 07:22 PM
| | Officer of the Wild Empire | | Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Yeovil, Somerset
Posts: 842
| | | Re: Pluteus under Limes
Quote:
Originally Posted by FungiJohn  Here's another two from Lime Tree Avenue
I'm assuming the first species is Pluteus sp. (found on wood litter debris) and the second species is Panaeolus sp. (in grass) ... But then I know I should never assume anything in this game
John | Hi John - were these found recently ?
The bottom one is (surprise !) a Psathyrella ! With the apendiculate veil fragments and the general 'jizz' probably Psathyrella marcescibilis !
I don't think that it fits P. candolleana in any of it's numerous forms due to the conic pileus !
It is very under-recorded but not actually infrequent at this trime of the year.
BUT it is a Psathyrella thus the usual comments about microscopy still apply BIG TIME !! 
The top one is, as you correctly say, a Pluteus but without microscopy of the cap structure we are on to a non-starter re: species !
What I can say is that is NOT one of the cervinus group and, despite the somewaht 'wrinkled' appearence to the pileus not P. thomsonii either !
Nick
Last edited by FungiJohn; 10-06-2008 at 07:34 PM.
|
10-06-2008, 07:34 PM
| | Knight of the Wild Empire | | Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Sheffield
Posts: 8,627
| | | Re: Pluteus under Limes
Quote:
Originally Posted by mykonik Hi John - were these found recently ?
The bottom one is (surprise !) a Psathyrella ! With the apendiculate veil fragments and the general 'jizz' probably Psathyrella marcescibilis !
I don't think that it fits P. candolleana in any of it's numerous forms due to the conic pileus !
It is very under-recorded but not actually infrequent at this trime of the year.
BUT it is a Psathyrella thus the usual comments about microscopy still apply BIG TIME !!
The top one is, as you correctly say, a Pluteus but without microscopy of the cap structure we are on to a non-starter re: species !
What I can say is that is NOT one of the cervinus group and, despite the somewaht 'wrinkled' appearence to the pileus not P. thomsonii either !
Nick | Hi Nick
Yes, both were found on 07_06_08.
The pluteus species were growing in large numbers whilst the Psathyrella were in smaller numbers. It is a surprise too!
Maybe I should revisit and collect some of both for further study
Thanks again Nick
John
PS Just checked and I have a few fruit bodies of the Psathyrella species.
Last edited by FungiJohn; 10-06-2008 at 07:43 PM.
Reason: PS added
|
10-06-2008, 08:27 PM
| | Knight of the Wild Empire | | Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Sheffield
Posts: 8,627
| | | Re: Pluteus under Limes
Here are the Psathyrella species Spores and ??? if it will help. 
John
Last edited by FungiJohn; 10-06-2008 at 08:59 PM.
|
10-06-2008, 08:53 PM
| | Frozen | | Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Hindhead
Posts: 1,104
| | | Re: Pluteus under Limes
I wondered about Pluteus phlebophorus for the first, though it is not a species I know well, and the cap is usually described as date-brown, not dark brown as you have. I cannot estimate the size of your specimens, but they look to be 2-3cm or am I way out?
As Nick indicates, it's not P. thomsonii. It might be P. nanus. My guess is that nanus means dwarf, if Latin is anything like modern French.
British Fungus Flora volume 4 covers Pluteus. Not easy!
P. phlebophorus has sub-globose to ellipsoidal spores (6-8)x(5-6.5)um2.
P. nanus has sub-globose spores (6-8)x(5-7)um2.
I would say that your spores rule out P. nanus due to shape.
The paler zone round the middle of the cap matches the description of P. phlebophorus in BFF4. I recommend the book if you do not have it. |
10-06-2008, 09:04 PM
| | Knight of the Wild Empire | | Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Sheffield
Posts: 8,627
| | | Re: Pluteus under Limes
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leif I wondered about Pluteus phlebophorus for the first, though it is not a species I know well, and the cap is usually described as date-brown, not dark brown as you have. I cannot estimate the size of your specimens, but they look to be 2-3cm or am I way out?
As Nick indicates, it's not P. thomsonii. It might be P. nanus. My guess is that nanus means dwarf, if Latin is anything like modern French.
British Fungus Flora volume 4 covers Pluteus. Not easy!
P. phlebophorus has sub-globose to ellipsoidal spores (6-8)x(5-6.5)um2.
P. nanus has sub-globose spores (6-8)x(5-7)um2.
I would say that your spores rule out P. nanus due to shape.
The paler zone round the middle of the cap matches the description of P. phlebophorus in BFF4. I recommend the book if you do not have it. | Hi Leif
The cap dia of the Pluteus was between 2.5 - 4 cm and they were quite dark. Indeed, difficult to see until you spotted the first!
The spores are of the Psathyrella species. I've just edited the thread to make it clear
John  |
10-06-2008, 09:58 PM
| | Frozen | | Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Hindhead
Posts: 1,104
| | | Re: Pluteus under Limes
Quote:
Originally Posted by FungiJohn The spores are of the Psathyrella species. | Doh! |
10-06-2008, 10:19 PM
| | Active Member | | Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: NW London
Posts: 56
| | | Re: Pluteus under Limes
Did you get a measurement for the Psathyrella spores John?
Andy |
10-06-2008, 10:29 PM
| | Knight of the Wild Empire | | Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Sheffield
Posts: 8,627
| | | Re: Pluteus under Limes
Quote:
Originally Posted by shroomboy Did you get a measurement for the Psathyrella spores John?
Andy | Approx 15 x 8 um Andy
John |
11-06-2008, 09:52 AM
| | Active Member | | Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: NW London
Posts: 56
| | | Re: Pluteus under Limes
That probably rules out P. marcescibilis which has spores of up to 13 x 7 um, one of the many forms of P. prona may be a possibility, which has longer and wider spores 14 x 8 um. It certainly isn't P. candolleana on this occasion, that we can be clear about.
Unfortunately without a decent monograph to the genus, at your disposal, it is very difficult to pin a lot of these 'Psath's' down.
Andy | | | |
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