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Old 24-10-2007, 11:17 PM
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Downland Fungi ID

Evening everyone...

Any idea's on the following...was found on chalk downland.





Cheers Jacob
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Old 25-10-2007, 08:53 PM
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Re: Downland Fungi ID

Anyone got any ideas?
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Old 25-10-2007, 09:05 PM
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Re: Downland Fungi ID

Clouded Agaric possibly?
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Old 25-10-2007, 09:06 PM
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Re: Downland Fungi ID

Interesting suggestion Stu and you might well be correct. Surprised I didn't notice the resemblance sooner...Never seen one with a big unbo like that on though...
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Old 25-10-2007, 09:07 PM
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Re: Downland Fungi ID

That was my first thought, the lumpy cap viewed from the top is very reminiscent of this species but the stem looks the wrong shape to me, I think this species is normally somewhat thicker at the bottom of the stem (I mean the stem tapers from a thick bottom to a slightly thinner top)... Also in my experience I've found this species in very dark locations, never out in the sun.
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Old 25-10-2007, 09:10 PM
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Re: Downland Fungi ID

Yes, again, well pointed out. The bulbous stem is a significant characteristic of Clitocybe Nebularis. However, I've seen them without.
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Old 25-10-2007, 09:41 PM
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Re: Downland Fungi ID

Clouded Agaric....is that poisonous? There were quite a number of them. Some were up too 15/20cm across.
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Old 25-10-2007, 09:52 PM
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Re: Downland Fungi ID

Said to be edilble but can cause gastric upsets in some people according to Rogers shrooms, you aint got a 100% ID for the shroom anyway so don't go scoffing it.

Check out Rogers Rogers Mushrooms - Clitocybe nebularis Mushroom

I don't think it is anyway, as Nick say's the cap don't seem right.
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Old 26-10-2007, 10:09 AM
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Re: Downland Fungi ID

Sometimes it helps to go back to basics if you find something you can't identify. The gill attachment and spore colour can be a good clue to help narrow things down. There is also no ring or ring zone on the stem, and no volva at the base of the stem, which rules out some options.

You can't always tell spore colour from a photo but on this specimen, which seems fairly mature, I'd assume it was going to be pale spored because the gills still look white. This would rule out all the pink, brown and black spored species.

Next the gill attachment. This isn't absolutely clear from the photo but I think they are actually slightly notched close to stem ie in the up-turned cap you can see that they dip down just before they reach the stem, although they are not free because they are still attached at the top of the stem.

Clitocybe would tend to have decurrent or broadly adnate gills ie gills that run down the stem or are broadly attached for the full width of the gill. For me this would rule out Clitocybe in this case. It also rules out other pale-spored groups such as Lepiota and Macrolepiota because these have gills that are free from the stem.

There are several pale-spored groups which could have notched gills but there aren't any hard and fast rules. With a chunky mushroom (sorry to use such a technical term) like this one you can rule out small white spored species such as Marasmius and Mycena which can have a wide range of gill attachments. Collybia is getting bigger, but there are a limited range of species in Collybia and once you get to know them, you can get the jizz. This isn't a Collybia. Collybia species tend to be intermediate in size between Mycena and Tricholoma or Melanoleuca but the size ranges do overlap.

With chunky pale-spored species with notched gills you are likely to be looking at a Tricholoma or a Melanoleuca. These aren't easy to separate by eye, although Melanoleuca species do tend to have an umbonate cap, and tend not to be fibrillose on the cap, but again these are just clues not rules because there are plenty of species of Tricholoma with smooth caps. But an important ecological factor is that all Tricholoma species are ectomycorrhizal and so would be found growing in woodland, or certainly near to trees, though the tree roots with which they are associated can be some distance from the tree itself. Melanoleuca species, on the other hand, are saprotrophs and so you can have species that feed on woodland litter or grow out in grasslands.

From the habitat and the jizz, my gut feeling is that this is a Melanoleuca, possibly something like Melanoleuca strictipes but since I don't find these unusual species of Melanoleuca very often I can't confidently narrow it down on the basis of a photo.

Melanoleuca is, in any case, a genus that needs a lot more work by the professional mycologists to characterise the different species. You tend to have to do the microscopy to separate the individual species.

Ken
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Old 26-10-2007, 11:28 AM
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Re: Downland Fungi ID

Thanks Ken - I'd been looking at this and not getting any decent logical thought going......... have printed out your advice and added it to my 'Ken's Explanation' File!!!

Pauline
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Old 26-10-2007, 02:15 PM
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Re: Downland Fungi ID

Quote:
Originally Posted by PMG View Post
Thanks Ken - I'd been looking at this and not getting any decent logical thought going......... have printed out your advice and added it to my 'Ken's Explanation' File!!!

Pauline
Lol.
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Old 26-10-2007, 08:11 PM
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Re: Downland Fungi ID

Thanks for that Ken....great knowledge! Looking on google at the pics of Melanoleuca strictipes it certainly looks the same. I guess I will never know what it was 100%
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