Entoloma - maybe

[CloudedYellow]

I believe this is an Entoloma but can't work out which.

Growing in broad-leaf (mainly birch) woodland, I found it last week growing from the end of a felled trunk. The trunk (I am guessing birch) was lying with a pile of others all rotting down well and when I tried to move it to for a better photo it disintegrated. A pity as the cap was a beautiful 'metallic' grey colour which was very photogenic in-situ.

The gills where white with a pink flush so I was not surprised to get a light pink spore print suggesting Pluteus. However, the spores were a surprise - they were different shapes and angular, which I believe indicate Entoloma? The photo only gives an idea of their 'angularity' which is much more obvious in 3D ie when moving the fine focus up and down.

So if an Entoloma which one? Most do not grow on wood so I thought my options would be few but I can't match it to any Entoloma sp. whether growing on wood or soil.

Any ideas please?



Richard

[Fungus Ken]

Well you certainly have me flummoxed with this one!

Like you, I would have plumped for Pluteus, but not just because of the habitat on wood and the gills tinged pink from the spores. Looking at your photo, it seems that the gills are actually free from the stem, which is more usual for Pluteus. Entoloma species tend to have attached gills (eg adnate or notched with a decurrent tooth), or at least gills that are adnexed rather than free ... but the odd species does have free gills.

But the spores you have photographed are not Pluteus spores, and the many angles do lead to Entoloma.

The fact that the wood it was growing on fell to pieces shows that it was already well rotted. By the time it gets to this stage the wood can be penetrated by the mycelium of fungi that are not specialist wood rotters so the substrate is not necessarily telling.

There isn't enough information in your photos for me to narrow it down to species. To take it any further, as a first step you would need to know the spore size and whether the spores are thin or thick walled.

Apart from the free gills, your specimen has what would be described as a tricholomatoid appearance. Other characters that might help to narrow it down are the white stem and the umbo in the centre of the cap which looks somewhat scaly.

Important clues would be whether or not the cap was hygrophanous ie did it change colour as it dried out? Also you should always smell a mushroom while it is fresh to look for any distinctive smells ... other than just mushroomy, of course! Lack of a distinctive smell can be a useful character ... as long as you don't have a cold at the time.

And in my experience a lot of Entolomas that look distinctive in the field usually end up causing extreme frustration when brought home because so many look so similar.

Ken

[CloudedYellow]

Thanks Ken,

You were kind enough not to ask if had I muddled the slides, I did wonder myself so I doubled checked - definitely the only pinkinsh spore print 'on the go' at the moment!

But at least I know what angular spores look like now.

Not hygrophanous and did not smell.

The spore size is 6.1-8.1x5.5-5.8u but I guess this does help.

I wasn't aware that spore wall thickness was important - is that something you would try to measure or do use experience to gauge this feature?

Richard

[Fungus Ken]

You wouldn't measure the spore wall thickness - it would be a judgement. But perhaps it will help if I explain the relevant step from the key I would use.

The key in Book 5 in the Fungi Europaei series deals with Entoloma. For fruitbodies that resemble a Tricholoma in habit you get to key D. This has a step that asks whether the spores are "remarkably small, thin-walled and very poorly angled, 6-9 x 5-7 microns" which takes you to a particular section.

The update, 5A, also has a step in the revised key which asks a similar question, so you get stuck without having the spore details.

The spore size you have quoted and the look of the spores in your photo suggests we are on the right lines if we assume they are small, thin walled and poorly angled. In both keys this takes you to section Turfosa, which narrows down the options considerably.

I won't run through all the steps but, based on the tricholomatoid habit, with a distinct umbo in the centre of a darkish coloured cap, and a white stipe this would take you to Entoloma turbidum. However, Entoloma turbidum should have a hygrophanous cap which should be translucently striate ... unlike your specimen, and it usually grows with conifers. Other options in this section seem unlikely.

So now you begin to see the fun you can have with Entolomas.

If you take another route in the keys and assume the spores are not small etc you run into the challenge of needing to know the shape of the gill edge cystidia ... which is always fun.

Options down this route could include Entoloma plebejum and Entoloma jubatum, but there are characters in your photo which don't quite fit.

So there I have to leave it and hope that someone who knows more about Entolomas can sort this one out.

Ken

[CloudedYellow]

Originally Posted by Fungus Ken

So there I have to leave it and hope that someone who knows more about Entolomas can sort this one out.

Ken

That's great Ken,

I don't think I will be able to sort this one out but your help has been useful.

Regards

Richard

[ecmyco]

Originally Posted by CloudedYellow

I believe this is an Entoloma but can't work out which.

Growing in broad-leaf (mainly birch) woodland, I found it last week growing from the end of a felled trunk. The trunk (I am guessing birch) was lying with a pile of others all rotting down well and when I tried to move it to for a better photo it disintegrated. A pity as the cap was a beautiful 'metallic' grey colour which was very photogenic in-situ.

The gills where white with a pink flush so I was not surprised to get a light pink spore print suggesting Pluteus. However, the spores were a surprise - they were different shapes and angular, which I believe indicate Entoloma? The photo only gives an idea of their 'angularity' which is much more obvious in 3D ie when moving the fine focus up and down.

So if an Entoloma which one? Most do not grow on wood so I thought my options would be few but I can't match it to any Entoloma sp. whether growing on wood or soil.

Any ideas please?





Richard

Perhaps Pluteus salicinus ?

[Fungus Ken]

Pluteus salicinus would have been my bet, had it not been for the spores in the photograph, which are not the right shape for Pluteus spores.

Of course, a photo of the pleurocystidia would have clarified things.

Ken

[ecmyco]

Originally Posted by Fungus Ken

Pluteus salicinus would have been my bet, had it not been for the spores in the photograph, which are not the right shape for Pluteus spores.

Of course, a photo of the pleurocystidia would have clarified things.

Ken

Hello,

My Pluteus salicinus

May be an error with the image of spores ?

ecmyco

[Fungus Ken]

You have a wonderful website, ecmyco.

Just a shame my French is not as good as your English obviously is.

Ken

[AlanS]

I also think this is Pluteus salicinus.

And the spores?

Well as far as I can see, they are NOT angled!

I think what has happened here is that the spores, very thin-walled in Pluteus, have become somewhat distorted, either through being massed together in a thick spore print or perhaps in the slide preparation. The result is that they seem to be a little angled, but this is not the natural shape of the spore.

The spores of Entoloma turbidum, E. jubatum and their ilk are rather obscurely angled, but the fungi themselves are certainly very different!

And to Ecmyco - it is really good to see you posting here. I have known of your excellent site for some time and I am sure we will all benefit from your knowledge.

Alan