Are these St. Georges?

[Mish]

Are these St. Georges? They appeared on our front lawn a couple of days ago, and I thought they looked similar to the St. Georges mushrooms I saw in a cookbook once. However, St. Georges are not native to my part of the world and so are not included in any of my field guides. Can someone give me a reliable description (including microscopic) of St. Georges mushrooms so I can be sure of the id? And, is the correct latin name Calocybe gambosa or Tricholoma gambosum?

Cheers!

[Stewy]

According to Rogers the gills should be Whiteish, I would say that yours are more Brownish possibly?

Do a spore print but use half Black and half White paper/card. The spore print should be White.

Rogers Mushrooms | Mushroom Pictures & Mushroom Reference

[FungiJohn]

Yes, these look like Calocybe gambosa to me. They do vary, especially with age and habitat. A search in the fungi gallery will illustrate this. However with any fungi you consider eating ... You must be 100% certain.

John

[endless autumn]

The smell of St George's is fairly distinctive: a pleasant mealy, raw flour aroma.

I must say I'm a bit worried by the gill colour (especially if you don't think St George's should grow where you live). Dunno what else they could be, though...

[FungiJohn]

I must order a decent monitor for work

On my home monitor, I do suspect these may be early fruiting field mushrooms ... pink gills and dark brown spores. St Georges have white spores.

You should also be aware of the poisonous Red staining inocybe, although this is mainly found in woodland clearings.

John

[m1.carson]

Hi,

They don't look like St Georges, the cap is too wavy, and the gills too brown, [that's my reference book speaking not me.]

I highly recomend a book called, yes you've guessed it :- MUSHROOMS and other fungi of Great Britain and Europe by Roger Phillips, it's definitely the best book on the subject I've ever seen, however, saying that, there's only about six species that I will eat, for every one you identify as edible there's another one that looks exactly like it thats poisonous.

Best to have a still living friend show you which you can eat.

Max.

[AlanS]

I also don't think these are Calocybe gambosa.

To me they look more like a Clitocybe - a large and difficult genus in which some species are dangerously poisonous.

As for "correct" latin names, this depends a lot on opinion. However, the large genus Tricholoma, originally defined on rather arbitrary morphological characters, has been well understood to be heterogenous, and the genus Calocybe has been split off as a seemingly natural group partly defined on their chemistry. There is currently a consensus that this is the best thing to do.

But what is your part of the world, Mish?

[In a sensible forum, new members like Mish and myself could edit our profiles immediately on joining, the most logical time, and say where we are from, but that does not apply here.]

In the UK, Calocybe gambosa is more common in the south but appears here in Scotland in warm periods in early summer. In my own experience it is particularly characteristic of roadsides and central reservations of dual carriageways. Perhaps its reputation for edibility has relied in the past on all that nice, crunchy lead it probably takes up??

Alan Silverside
(a mycologist but not a mycophagist)

[m1.carson]

Hi alans,

You're quite correct about the latin names, calocybe gambosa doesn't exist in my "best ever book" printed 1981, the nearest I can get to it is one of the species I will eat, the lead and salt laden agaricus bernadii, except that there are another four agaricii it may be, all, I'm glad to say are edible. this one almost bleeds when cut, and lives by the side of roads.

As a mycologist, could you say why, in my youth you could pick and eat fungi and rarely see signs of maggot infestation, today all bar giant puffballs are riddled with them before the've even got out of the ground.

Thanks Max.
P.S. Reading, Berks.

[Mish]

My part of the world is Tasmania, Australia! The mushrooms in question were found in my front garden, which is a common place to find introduced fungi. I also suspected the gills were a bit too brown, but the spore print is white. The gill attachment is adnate too, you can't see that in my photo. I've been a bit busy and havn't yet compiled a complete description, but as soon as I have I'll see if I can find a copy of Roger Phillips. And don't worry, I'm not gonna eat them!

Thanks! From Mish!

[m1.carson]

Hi mish,

Somehow I don't think Mr Phillips book quite covers Auzzieland species, you'll need to find a good one over there.

Max.

[Mish]

Hi Max,

That is true to an extent, but I believe that these may not be 'Aussieland' mushrooms, they are not occurring in a native forest but in a garden full of imported European plants. Many fungal species have been introduced to Australia on the roots or in the soil associated with imported plants- including Amanita phalloides and Amanita muscaria- the latter which is now considered an invasive pest in native forests! Besides, many species are cosmopolitan, and fungal taxonomy in Australia is so badly neglected (around 5,600 described species out of the 250,000 species estimated to exist), that sometimes we HAVE to rely on European field guides!

cheers! From Mish

[m1.carson]

Hi,

I stand corrected .

Anyway if you're going to try and buy the Roger Phillips book, my edition was published by Macmillan Reference in 1994, then :- 13 15 17 19 18 16 14 [ which I assume is a catalogue No]
and then, ISBN 0 330 264419, which probably IS a ref No.

The only other piece of info is:-
Specialist booksellers
The Richmond Publishing Co Ltd.,
Orchard Rd.,
Richmond,
Surrey.

And

Wheldon and Wesley Ltd.,
Lytton cottage,
Codicote,
Hitchin,
Herts. I couldn't say if either are still in businness.

Good luck,
Max.

[AlanS]

Originally Posted by m1.carson

Hi,

I stand corrected .

Anyway if you're going to try and buy the Roger Phillips book, my edition was published by Macmillan Reference in 1994, then :- 13 15 17 19 18 16 14 [ which I assume is a catalogue No]
and then, ISBN 0 330 264419, which probably IS a ref No.

The only other piece of info is:-
Specialist booksellers
The Richmond Publishing Co Ltd.,
Orchard Rd.,
Richmond,
Surrey.

And

Wheldon and Wesley Ltd.,
Lytton cottage,
Codicote,
Hitchin,
Herts. I couldn't say if either are still in businness.

Good luck,
Max.

Wheldon & Wesley are gone I'm afraid - a long and involved story that included a disastrous marriage.

I also hear that the Richmond Publishing Co., who left Richmond a number of years ago, also no longer function as a retail outlet.

Roger Phillips has a new version of his book out, now titled "Mushrooms", published by Macmillan in 2006, in a more compact format (i.e. smaller pages but more of them). It is quite substantially updated.


Mish, it occurs to me that in the southern hemisphere, you will be getting autumnal fungi now, not early summer fungi such as St. George's Mushroom.

Looking at your photographs again, I now think they might be a Lepista species, though the distinction between Lepista and my previous suggestion of Clitocybe is somewhat nebulous. (There is a kind of pun hidden in that last statement .....)

Alan

[Stewy]

Is that it for the St Georges then?

[Mish]

Yes- they dissapeared under my father-in-law's lawnmower. I'll have to wait for next year now!

[Stewy]

I mean the season in the UK

[jennyb]

I had some in early April, but this week another has appeared in the same place.

Having read this thread, maybe this weeks is not St Georges? Have not taken any photos.

Jenny

[FungiJohn]

Originally Posted by Stewy

I mean the season in the UK

Plenty on Lime Tree Avenue at Clumber Park today Stew

John