Plans To Charge For Household Rubbish

[Kymba]

I have be following this with interest for a few weeks now and wonder what others think.
A plan to bill every household in England for the amount of rubbish they leave out for the dustman is being discussed to help meet an EU directive to reduce drastically the 1,400 landfill sites in the UK over the next eight years.

At the moment there are 3 options they are looking at :

1) The most likely system would be a specific charge for each sack of rubbish - possibly allowing each household one or two free sacks a week - and levying a charge of up to £1 on each extra sack. This would provide an incentive for people to recycle or compost more of their kitchen waste.

2) Would be a flat charge on every household - for example, £5 a month - that filled up more than two sacks a week. Councils would be encouraged to come up with their own variations.

3)A third possibility is to introduce the weighing of wheelie bins in dustcarts resulting in charges for excess weight paid by the householder. Similar schemes have been piloted in Europe
They are also considering whether charging should be introduced at household waste tips - except where people are dumping rubbish for recycling - to reduce landfill use.

I personally think this will lead to more fly tipping and cause a bigger problem for the enviroment and its Wildlife.

Anyone else got any views on this??

[Tinkerbell]

I totally agree with you Kymba. And, with regard to charging for the removal of rubbish - there is already a charge made by councils for this service, it's called Council Tax!

Tinkerbell

[smartie]

I also agree that the most likely consequence of this would not be increased recycling but increased fly tipping. Or dumping of rubbish in neighbours' bins, which we have already seen some of here, where the council won't take any extra bags that are not in the wheelie bin. Some of my neighbours have been seen putting extra bags in my bin, which is never full. I don't make an issue of it now, but I would move into full bin rage mode if I were being charged.

[Paul mabbott]

We've been through this before - at great length! The idea is to have a differential toll so that those who create a lot of waste have to pay for it and may consider ways to reduce their waste. On the other hand, those of us who don't create much waste will save on our bills. Seems a good idea to me although I still have doubts about how it will work ...

[Kymba]

We dont have Wheelie Bins here we are allowed to put 5 Black sacks out a week for household waste (they will take more though if in good mood) and we have a Small Blue Box for recycling which is so small you can fill it in 2 days if you recycle everything you should. This is emptied ONCE a Fortnight!!! So to me this is one problem they need to readdress!! These Boxes need to be emptied Weekly to encourage people to use them more effectively... I know from talking to my neighbours that they dont recycle as much as they should because they dont want it hanging around for two weeks so it is easier to put it in with the Household waste!!

[Hawkwind]

Originally Posted by Kymba

I have be following this with interest for a few weeks now and wonder what others think.
A plan to bill every household in England for the amount of rubbish they leave out for the dustman is being discussed to help meet an EU directive to reduce drastically the 1,400 landfill sites in the UK over the next eight years.

At the moment there are 3 options they are looking at :

1) The most likely system would be a specific charge for each sack of rubbish - possibly allowing each household one or two free sacks a week - and levying a charge of up to £1 on each extra sack. This would provide an incentive for people to recycle or compost more of their kitchen waste.

2) Would be a flat charge on every household - for example, £5 a month - that filled up more than two sacks a week. Councils would be encouraged to come up with their own variations.

3)A third possibility is to introduce the weighing of wheelie bins in dustcarts resulting in charges for excess weight paid by the householder. Similar schemes have been piloted in Europe
They are also considering whether charging should be introduced at household waste tips - except where people are dumping rubbish for recycling - to reduce landfill use.

I personally think this will lead to more fly tipping and cause a bigger problem for the enviroment and its Wildlife.

Anyone else got any views on this??

Yes I agree with you, this new form of taxation by our local councils would lead to fly-tipping and people will be burning their domestic waste in their gardens which will lead to more carbon emmissions. Dumping of rubbish in the countryside will increase and it will cost our councils ( and the council tax payer ) more to clean up.

[smartie]

Originally Posted by Paul mabbott

We've been through this before - at great length! The idea is to have a differential toll so that those who create a lot of waste have to pay for it and may consider ways to reduce their waste. On the other hand, those of us who don't create much waste will save on our bills. Seems a good idea to me although I still have doubts about how it will work ...

We know what the idea is, Paul, and I wouldn't disagree that it is a reasonable idea in principle, but it is precisely as you say - the worries are about how it could possibly be made to work. I don't think it can. None of the proposals that have been put forward so far seem to me to be viable. And, in general, previous experience in other areas is that you don't change people's behaviour much by differential taxation (which this effectively would be). I think Kymba is right, that people's behaviour is more likely to be positively changed by more energetic attempts by local authorities to make recycling more convenient. My own LA has just sent a leaflet round asking for our opinions on charging and on what would make us more likely to recycle, so I hope that may lead to some improvements.

[lewisa]

Bin has lock -

Bin doesnt have lock -


Thats about the long and short of it for me.

[Oscar2006]

An interesting thread and I'd like to put my fifty pence worth in.
In my area (Pork pie town) we have 4 different collection bins:
1 large black bin for non-recyclable waste which holds about 5-6 large dustbin liners.
1 large brown bin (same size as above) for garden waste/greens/compostibles.
These are emptied every other week in rotation. (black week 1, brown week 2)
Also:
1 grey bin about 24" x 18" x 14" for recycling cans/glass/plastic bottles etc.
1 green bin (same size as above) for paper/textile recycling.
These are emptied every week.

I have a family of 5 + dog and never have a problem with a lack of room in a bin except at Xmas, but then they do extra pickups.
This has worked very well for about 3 years now, but more could be done to reduce landfill and also stuff going down the sewers (oils and fats for example which could be collected, separated and reused (bio diesel))

I'm happy to be involved with recycling everything practical, but would be completely against being charged extra for my Black bin disposal, as I feel I already pay for this service!

One of the pieces of environmental legislation puts some responsibility for packaging on producers/suppliers, and they already pay a levy (tax) on this, as they know it will almost certainly end up in landfill!
Other legislation makes producers/suppliers responsible for collection of items at the end of their life, many parts from them can be reused. (Cars, PC's etc.) Much more could be done here I feel.

We are all responsible for the waste that we generate and only by making our thoughts known to producers and suppliers can we expect significant changes to be made.
Can we go back to buying food packaged in waxy paper rather than plastic/cling film please?

[jennyb]

We lived for a number of years in the Netherlands. There we had 2 small dustbins (in the days before wheely bins were invented). If you wanted extra bins you had to pay for them which I think is quite fair.

HOWEVER, changing to this system in the UK now would be very fair but, I'm sure, create more fly-tipping. I was amused by Smartie's neighbours putting things in her bins - we get several recycling baskets for glass, cans, papers and textiles, but I am always embarrassed by the number of wine bottles in ours and have actually thought of distributing them along the street BTW, red wine is apparently good for you.

Until about 2 months ago, I did not realise that our council recycled plastic and cardboard since they do not allow you to put these out in the recycling baskets. When I found out that they do recycle these items and have a collection point at my local supermarket, I have been religiously recycling them and have reduced the contents of our wheely bin by half. Why did the council not make it clear to everyone that although they do not collect plastics and cardboard, they will still recycle it if taken to a collection point?

Jenny (hic!)

[nightshade]

We already have to take our bags to the pavement (but not leave it out all night)
there is an increase in rats due to the mild (so far)winter next thing will be hijackers
putting rubbish in other peoples bins,they(the owners of the hijacked bins) would then be fined for putting the wrong materials in the wrong bins through no fault of their own,this will increase the carbon deficit as people go to the local amenities site to recycle(only to be charged on arrival) there will be an increase in fly tipping,council tax will rise to pay the pensions of the out of work refuse collectors as we will be doing all the work
PS the gales and heavy rain left black bags of refuse scattered all around the pavements
and roads of my town,it was suggested that the householders cleaned it up as they were responsible for their own frontage
I want to emigrate!!

[Susie]

I am still trying to adjust to the way they collect rubbish here in Horsham. In Hillingdon we used to recycle tins, paper, cardboard, plastic bottles and glass in one bag, green waste in another (although mine all used to go on the compost heap) and the rest would go into as many black bags as you needed. But now tins and plastic bottles have to go into one box, cardboard (not corrugated or paper) go into a bin with the green waste and these are collected on alternate weeks and we have one small bin for general rubbish which is collected weekly. One small bin for a family of five - they have got to be kidding! There is no way, regardless of how carefully we recycle, we will get a week's worth of rubbish in that bin and so my husband has to take the extra rubbish either to the dump or to work and stick it in the skip. It's daft.

[Jennywrenny]

Originally Posted by jennyb

I am always embarrassed by the number of wine bottles in ours and have actually thought of distributing them along the street BTW, red wine is apparently good for you.

Until about 2 months ago, I did not realise that our council recycled plastic and cardboard since they do not allow you to put these out in the recycling baskets. When I found out that they do recycle these items and have a collection point at my local supermarket, I have been religiously recycling them and have reduced the contents of our wheely bin by half. Why did the council not make it clear to everyone that although they do not collect plastics and cardboard, they will still recycle it if taken to a collection point?

Jenny (hic!)

Maybe you should think about buying a box of red wine instead like I do!

We have a compost bin and we also drop off our own plastic bottles and cardboard at the local recycling point because it isn't collected - we only have the black bin and one Small Blue box for glass and tins. We are hopefully going to be provided with a green bin soon. I'm sure people would recycle more if they were provided with the appropriate bins - it's surprising how much we take ourselves each week but I'm not sure how easy or convenient it is for other people to do this. Also, if it's not easy or convenient then people are going to be reluctant to recycle. Providing everyone with the bins would help such a lot.

[Kymba]

Here are a few facts on this i found quite Alarming.

The UK disposes of more than 27 million tons of waste in this way each year - 7 million more than any other country, the LGA says.

This is the equivalent of half a ton per household, per year, making the UK the "dustbin of Europe", it says.

An area of 109 square miles is now landfill and landfill space could run out in 2016, it adds.

Germany, which has a population 25% bigger than the UK, puts 10m tons into rubbish tips each year

Councils face fines of up to £150 per metric ton of landfill waste, and the association is warning these costs could be passed on to taxpayers.

There was speculation that families could end up paying up to £100 more each year.

Around 30 councils are known to have already fitted microchips - dubbed 'bin bugs' - to their wheelie bins which can weigh refuse as it is loaded on to dustcarts.

The chips would carry information about which address the bin belonged to.
The weight of rubbish in each bin would be measured by equipment installed in collection trucks.

[Billy Wobble Dagger]

Any extra charge for the disposal of rubbish will of course lead to further fly tipping. I found an old fridge freezer left in the entrance to a field within half a mile of our local tip where it could have been disposed of for free. The real answer is for the companies who produce our day-to-day requirement to cut down on packaging. Why are apples and potatoes etc put on trays and covered in cling film, no need. Why are fish and chips put on a plastic tray, no need. Why do we get junk mail and why are there so many fliers in magazines, no need. Why do people use so many plastic carrier bags? I was in woollies the other day and the woman in front of me purchased two pyrex dishes with lids, not in boxes. The woman at the till used 10 plastic carriers to wrap them, no need. The government need to tackle these basics before they start telling us to recycle more. And why I’m moaning, if Phillips are advertising this new power saving light bulb saying we should use them why are they still making and selling the old ones.
Basically we need to shop where possible at local independent shops, e.g. farm shops, farmers markets etc where most things are loose and packaging is minimal and then take them home in bags for life. If we all and I do mean all did this then the amount of rubbish would drop dramatically.
The government need to impose more restriction on the producers and packaging companies first before targeting us.

BWD

[nightshade]

BWD is right ,use your local farm shops,time was every household had a
shopping basket and shopped daily for fresh food, no packaging there is
talk of potatoes being sold with the dirt on as it helps prolong shelf life
(it could also mislead people who associate mud with Organic)

[Tormentil]

Originally Posted by nightshade

BWD is right ,use your local farm shops,

All very well if you're close to a farm shop and are willing to pay a slightly higher price.

there is talk of potatoes being sold with the dirt on as it helps prolong shelf life

An old grocers trick to get more money for less goods. ?

[henrya]

People link the rubbish collection problem with an increase in rats and other scavengers. If we didn't throw away so much food, there wouldn't be a problem!

henrya

[Oscar2006]

Originally Posted by Tormentil

All very well if you're close to a farm shop and are willing to pay a slightly higher price.



An old grocers trick to get more money for less goods. ?

"My local" farm shop is 7 miles away, but is far cheaper than any Supermarket in town.

It is about deciding to make the right changes for the right reasons.
We can all (well probably all of us) do more to reduce the amount of household rubbish we send to landfill.
If we can do this quickly across the whole UK then the local councils would be more likely to hit their targets and the Government might hold off charging for a bit longer.

[Billy Wobble Dagger]

[quote=Tormentil;84875]All very well if you're close to a farm shop and are willing to pay a slightly higher price.[quote]

At our farm shop there isn't a great deal of difference between prices with some things cheaper than the supermarkets. However the difference in taste is always huge. People get used to the processed food in supermarkets, how can pork chops all be identical and weigh the same? The answer is simple they can't be unless someone is meddling with them. Give me real meat, and veg that is all odd shapes, because that is how it's meant to be. And almost no packaging.

BWD

[Tormentil]

Originally Posted by Billy Wobble Dagger

At our farm shop there isn't a great deal of difference between prices with some things cheaper than the supermarkets. However the difference in taste is always huge.

But how can we be sure that the vegetables sold in a farm shop are not from the same crop that is sold in bulk to the supermarkets ?

[Billy Wobble Dagger]

Originally Posted by Tormentil

But how can we be sure that the vegetables sold in a farm shop are not from the same crop that is sold in bulk to the supermarkets ?

I can only talk about our local farm shop, which you can probably tell I'm a huge fan of, they keep a trail of all the food they sell, stating the name and address of each farm etc. If that farm also delivers to my local co-op then great. And one more thing the staff at the farm shop are happy and chatty and give the impression they enjoy working there, and that make a difference. It always nice to get a grumpy person on the till at the co-op, not!

If any body is passing through West Oxfordshire check out The Foxbury farm shop. They make the most fantastic sausages as well.

BWD