Go Back   Wild About Britain > Environment Forums > Environment Forum

» Log in

User Name:

Password:

Not a member yet?
Register Now!

» March 2010

S M T W T F S
28 1 2 3 4 5 6
7 8 9 10 11 12 13
14 15 16 17 18 19 20
21 22 23 24 25 26 27
28 29 30 31 123

» Stats

Members: 34,098
Threads: 51,301
Posts: 561,165
Top Poster: glsammy (13,488)
Welcome to our newest member, jordan1248
Welcome to the Wild About Britain forums
Reply

 

LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 07-09-2007, 03:13 PM
Gill Catton's Avatar
Knight Commander of the Wild Empire
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Near Peterborough
Posts: 5,961
New Biodiversity Action Plans

I'm going to start this by talking about birds but feel free continue with other aspects of the BAP that interest you...

I read the new priority lists with interest, considerably more birds species and an interesting decision to drop down to specific races of the birds in question......

so is this positive allowing protection and targets to be tied to specific races

or negative in scaring people off who would otherwise submit records but who aren't confident in identifying the modularis race of the dunnock...

I'm somewhere in between, I like the increased number of species listed (although I recognise this as being a lot of extra work )- it gives me a stronger base to get various species considered properly with regard to development ..... However, there's no way I'd be able to separate british Larus argentatus argentatus from wintering Scandinavian ones - there's probably not that many people in the country who can confidently!!!

It seems part of the reasoning is to allow greater protection of uk races of birds - but that didn't seem to bother the likes of the RSPB, Natural England etc when it comes to red kites or sea eagles..........


also with plants 14 species of hawkweed with no english names - am I the only one who shudders at this?
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 10-09-2007, 01:17 PM
Active Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: As the name suggests, in the Chilterns
Posts: 97
Re: new biodiversity Action Plans discuss

Hi Gill,

I don’t think going down to individual races is helpful in most cases except when dealing with some habitat compensation / restoration projects. Although I can see the temptation of using races when trying to protect sites from development if you’re relying on species which are reasonably common. However, I’ve been involved in lots of public inquiries and its hard enough getting agreement on the presence or absence of different species, survey methodologies and what significance criteria to use (don’t mention IEEM criteria or I’ll scream!). If you have to argue the case not only on species but on race as well, the planning inspector will either be confused, think it’s an irrelevant argument between specialists or commit suicide through boredom (not good for your case but a tactic often used by development friendly ecological consultants). I was at an inquiry when an inspector seemed to drop off to sleep after 3 days argument about the distribution of red data book invertebrates and I wasn’t far behind.

Also, think of the poor old planners who have to put in Biodiversity policies in their Regional Spatial Strategies (RSS) and Local Development Documents. Many try valiantly but don’t have much of a clue regarding the value and legislative background of why biodiversity matters to them. I’m dealing with a Sustainability Appraisal of a RSS at the moment and most of the RSS Steering Group hadn’t heard of priority BAP habitats or their responsibilities to Habitats of Principal Importance under the Natural Environment and Rural Communities Act 2006 section 40, so how can they be expected to worry about races when they don’t even understand the basics?

Races should be used at site level when looking at site compensation or restoration, I always consider local provenance, it can be the difference between success and failure e.g. with tidal v freshwater phragmites, but it should be kept out of the planning system as it’s a charter for unscrupulous consultants to bog-down planning inquiries in superfluous detail that planners and inspectors often don’t understand.

Chris
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 11-09-2007, 08:16 AM
Gill Catton's Avatar
Knight Commander of the Wild Empire
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Near Peterborough
Posts: 5,961
Re: new biodiversity Action Plans discuss

I agree entirely I don't think they have properly thought about who uses BAPS over and above those people managing reserves.....

Its weird thought because it only seems to be with birds that they have dropped them all down to race level...

Its also rather frightening that any old hawthorn dominant - managed to within an inch of its life - hedgrow has been added and any old ponds even rotten polluted ones full of car parts and dead things...... surly BAP targets shouldn't be about preserving such things but about making them better or even removing them completely and replacing with something better?
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 11-09-2007, 01:26 PM
Active Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: As the name suggests, in the Chilterns
Posts: 97
Re: new biodiversity Action Plans discuss

Gill,

Pond Conservation has suggested a change to the pond classification and that this change is likely to be accepted. This was because JNCC thought that just using ‘ponds’ was too inclusive. The priority habitat will now only be ‘Ponds of High Conservation Value’ i.e. about the top 5% of ponds.

I have Pond Conservation’s original submission for the change. If it’s of any use to you, I’ll send it over.

I don’t know about the hedge side of things, I’m more on the wet and squelchy side of the fence.

Chris
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 11-09-2007, 01:42 PM
Gill Catton's Avatar
Knight Commander of the Wild Empire
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Near Peterborough
Posts: 5,961
Re: new biodiversity Action Plans discuss

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiltern Chris View Post
Gill,

Pond Conservation has suggested a change to the pond classification and that this change is likely to be accepted. This was because JNCC thought that just using ‘ponds’ was too inclusive. The priority habitat will now only be ‘Ponds of High Conservation Value’ i.e. about the top 5% of ponds.

I have Pond Conservation’s original submission for the change. If it’s of any use to you, I’ll send it over.

I don’t know about the hedge side of things, I’m more on the wet and squelchy side of the fence.

Chris
interesting since the new lists don't appear to be draft - they appear to be decided....

NewPriorityList
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 11-09-2007, 04:04 PM
Active Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: As the name suggests, in the Chilterns
Posts: 97
Re: new biodiversity Action Plans discuss

Hi Gill,

I've not been through all the stuff on the UK BAP web site to see what's been put on the web but the Priorities Species and Habitats Review Working Group accepted the Pond Conservation submission and although the term ‘ponds’ was kept as a generic term for the priority habitat, what it means is described on p131 of Annex 5 of the Species and Habitats Review Report 2007.

http://www.ukbap.org.uk/library/BRIG...Annexes4-6.pdf

This states the criteria for ponds a priority habitat as:

UK BAP priority habitat Ponds are defined as permanent and seasonal standing water bodies up to 2ha in extent which meet one or more of the following criteria:

• Habitats of international importance. Ponds that meet criteria under Annex I of the Habitats Directive.

• Species of high conservation importance. Ponds supporting Red Data Book species, UK BAP species, species fully protected under the Wildlife and Countryside Act Schedule 5 and 8, Habitats Directive Annex II species, a Nationally Scarce wetland plant species, or three Nationally Scarce aquatic invertebrate species.

• Exceptional assemblages of key biotic groups: Ponds supporting exceptional populations or numbers of key species. Based on (i) criteria specified in guidelines for the selection of biological SSSIs (currently amphibians and dragonflies only), and (ii) exceptionally rich sites for plants or invertebrates (i.e. supporting ≥30 wetland plant species or ≥50 aquatic macroinvertebrate species).

• Ponds of high ecological quality: Ponds classified in the top PSYM category (“high”) for ecological quality (i.e. having a PSYM score ≥75%). [PSYM (the Predictive SYstem for Multimetrics) is a method for assessing the biological quality of still waters in England and Wales; plant species and / or invertebrate families are surveyed using a standard method; the PSYM model makes predictions for the site based on environmental data and using a minimally impaired pond dataset; comparison of the prediction and observed data gives a % score for ponds quality]

• Other important ponds: Individual ponds or groups of ponds with a limited geographic distribution recognised as important because of their age, rarity of type or landscape context e.g. pingos, duneslack ponds, machair ponds.

Hope that helps,

Cheers, Chris
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 20-09-2007, 02:20 PM
almostnormal's Avatar
Officer of the Wild Empire
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Broad Hinton (thats near swindon)
Posts: 874
Blog Entries: 3
Send a message via MSN to almostnormal
Re: new biodiversity Action Plans discuss

you're definitely no the only one who read the hawkweed bit with trepidation. i had to go and sit in a darkened corner and repeat 'its a daisy not a dragon' lots of times.

i think the bap lists for birds are weird. i don't really understand why they've dropped them down to race. i'm a bird person and i'd be hard pushed to tell you whether one dunnock is a different race to another. ringer's would probably have better luck! on the other hand if its breeding in this country its probably a british black tailed godwit, not an icelandic one!
__________________
I enjoy my life...its the only one I've got :D
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 30-10-2007, 02:42 PM
GRH GRH is offline
Member of the Wild Empire
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 292
Re: New Biodiversity Action Plans

Biodiversity isn't just about species - it's about races and subspecies as well (and habitats of course). If we lose a race or a subspecies we lose biodiversity. If we took off everything that was tricky to identify a lot of opportunities would be lost. The BAP list is about decline more than anything else. There are many species on it that are common and widespread but have declined a lot (eg quite a lot of the moths!), and adding them to the BAP list opens up funding opportunities to look into the causes of that decline. Habitats are a different issue. If you only list the habitats of high value then you lose the opportunity to bring those not so good ones up to scratch, and risk those good ones that get mismanaged dropping off the list. The BAP list isn't purely for any one audience (especially not for those managing reserves), it's a list of the Government's conservation priorities.

Greg
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Reply  

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


» New Wildlife Posts

Go to first new post Mange in foxes
Last post by sumbody
Today 02:15 PM
43 Replies, 4,078 Views
Go to first new post bullocks
Last post by JoulesH
Today 02:12 PM
5 Replies, 46 Views
Go to first new post Why is the Chaffinch...
Last post by aeshna5
Today 02:10 PM
3 Replies, 43 Views
Go to first new post American Robin
Last post by aeshna5
Today 02:08 PM
8 Replies, 827 Views
Go to first new post Bird of the day!
Last post by aeshna5
Today 02:06 PM
4,406 Replies, 105,342 Views
Go to first new post Boxing Hares?
Last post by kenny243
Today 02:02 PM
19 Replies, 4,016 Views
Go to first new post Sarcoscypha at last
Last post by Leif
Today 01:58 PM
1 Replies, 24 Views
Go to first new post Plastic Netting on Fat...
Last post by Monkey Orchid
Today 01:55 PM
7 Replies, 130 Views

» New Environment Posts

Go to first new post Nuclear Power Station...
Last post by animartco
Today 02:07 PM
163 Replies, 2,818 Views
Go to first new post Warm fusion = free clean...
Last post by Doggle Avaddit
Yesterday 09:13 PM
91 Replies, 1,696 Views
Go to first new post How to Recycle your...
Last post by posie
17-03-2010 08:47 AM
6 Replies, 484 Views
Go to first new post what do you think is the...
Last post by tom00_uk
14-03-2010 04:30 AM
18 Replies, 504 Views

» New Activity Posts

Go to first new post Remote IR Cameras & the...
Last post by kenny243
Today 02:16 PM
2 Replies, 86 Views
Go to first new post New Job!
Last post by diggleken
Today 01:48 PM
20 Replies, 177 Views
Go to first new post Vine weevil attack -...
Last post by Cotham Marble
Today 09:21 AM
5 Replies, 66 Views
Go to first new post Coast to Coast Walk...
Last post by foxy mars
Today 01:15 AM
206 Replies, 3,994 Views

» New Community Posts

Go to first new post Calling WABers in...
Last post by posie
Today 01:22 PM
1 Replies, 16 Views
Go to first new post Osprey meet, Rutland...
Last post by mrcheeky
Today 09:47 AM
47 Replies, 1,157 Views
Go to first new post Harbour Seal does daring...
Last post by Jaeviatrix
Yesterday 12:00 PM
4 Replies, 159 Views
Go to first new post A tv date for your...
Last post by artdemole
18-03-2010 02:40 PM
3 Replies, 157 Views

All times are GMT. The time now is 02:16 PM.


Copyright Wild About Britain 2009

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360 361 362 363 364 365 366 367 368 369 370 371 372 373 374 375 376 377 378 379 380 381 382 383 384 385 386 387 388 389 390 391 392 393 394 395 396 397 398 399 400 401 402 403 404 405 406 407 408 409 410 411 412 413 414 415 416 417 418 419 420 421 422 423 424 425 426 427 428 429 430 431 432 433 434 435 436 437 438 439 440 441 442 443 444 445 446 447 448 449 450 451 452 453 454 455 456 457 458 459 460 461 462 463 464 465 466 467 468 469 470 471 472 473 474 475 476 477 478 479 480 481 482 483 484 485 486 487 488 489 490 491 492 493 494 495 496 497 498 499 500 501 502 503 504 505 506 507 508 509 510 511 512 513 514 515 516 517 518 519 520 521 522 523 524 525 526 527 528 529 530 531 532 533 534 535 536 537 538 539 540 541 542 543 544 545 546 547 548 549 550 551 552 553 554 555 556 557 558 559 560 561 562 563 564 565 566 567 568 569 570 571 572 573 574 575 576 577 578 579 580 581 582 583 584 585 586 587 588 589 590 591 592 593 594 595 596 597 598 599 600 601 602 603 604 605 606 607 608 609 610 611 612 613 614 615 616 617 618 619 620 621 622 623 624 625 626 627 628 629 630 631 632 633 634 635 636 637 638 639 640 641 642 643 644 645 646 647 648 649 650 651 652 653 654 655 656 657 658 659 660 661 662 663 664 665 666 667 668 669 670 671 672 673 674 675 676 677 678 679 680 681 682 683 684 685 686 687 688 689 690 691 692 693