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Originally Posted by fuelwise  There seems to be more than a little confusion here! The hho generator is in no way connected to the existing vehicles fuel system. It extracts hydrogen and oxygen from water using a stand alone system (excepting the electrical supply) and feeds it into the vehicles air intake. It works, I have run 2 vans and 2 cars for two years!  |
Right, so the vehicled air intake is not part of the fuel system? (That's a rhetorical question by the way.)
In fact what tou have just described is a 'single point fuel injection system'. Most of the posters are quite aware that we are not talking about putting water in the fuel tank, or at leat those who know what they are talking about.
The system is the same as a gas converison kit to allow your car to run on proper gas fuel. (Ie not gasoline. When I'm talking about gas I mean gas, not petrol.) You could run it on LPG, or hydrogen, or any gas which will burn. (The strorage tank may differ, and the regulators may need to set a different flow rate, but the princilble is the same.)
Ok, so exactly what is HHO? Dihydrogen Monoxide is what. That is WATER you. There is NO repeat NO special way of combining hydrogen and oxygen in the ratio 2:1 except as water.
You are talking about running a car on hydrogen. Anything else is either snake oil, or too bloody dangerous to contemplate.
Extracting hydrogen and oxygen from water using electricity is called ELECTROLYSIS it's been around for well over a hundred years, and is not a new process. It is NOT efficient. Nor is it COST EFFECTIVE. (Unless your electricity is virtually free.)
If there is a better electrolysis method then sure it's less inefficient, but even at 100% efficiency (in terms of using
all the electricity to separate the hydrogen and oxygen, which is impossible in practice) the electricity has to come from somewhere. If it is delivered via the mains supply to your home, then there are inevitable losses in transmission, and this is probably the most efficient means of producing electricity you have available as large generating stations operate at a higher efficiency then small generators. (By a long way!)
Ok you might be generating your power from your own wind-power unit. But for everyday use motor vehicles use huge amounts of energy. A
small (and I mean tiny) car produces 40-50KW just getting around,
and that's what's left over after all the inefficiencies of the internal combusion engine design.
That works out at say 200KW of power input from the fuel. So if you have say a 10KW wind turbine (Which is about the biggest you are going to get) and you get 100% effiecency, then to run your car for one hour you need twenty hours of full generation from your turbine.
That might just work out, but it's a big wind turbine, bigger than you might imagine. (And depends on a nice steady breeze!)
So yep you could supplement your fuel with hydrogen without paying the electricity company more then the equivalent in petrol, but you will be spending a lot of money up-front for your wind-turbine generating system, and maintenance won't be free.
I don't have a problem with that. I have a problem where people say it is more efficient. (It is not.) I have a problem where people say it is a liquid fuel (it is not), and I get very worried that people are talking about mixed hydrogen and oxygen in a tank. (Which is hugely dangerous. Ask the crew of the challenger shuttle. Oh dear. No you can't. They are all dead. And the hydrogen and oxygen were in separate tanks. How safe is that?)
I have already said that there are systems which utilise water as a means of extracting the wasted heat from a conventional engine. They require substantial engine modification, and are not yet practical, and need vey clean water to work.
If such engines were practical every military vehicle would be equipped with such engines, as fuel supply is a major headache in all modern military scenarios. Reducing the cost and frequency of supply would be a great advantage. (Ok dessert operations might pose a few problems, but no more than currently experienced.) Such an engine system would not be a military secret for long.
If I'm wrong, point me to the patents describing the HHO sytem. I will be glad to look them over. If the sytem works, it will be patented. (Only an idiot would not have world patent's on this!) If it is patented, it will be available for public scrutiny. So find me the patent, and I will tell you exactly why it does not work.
(And by the way, there is no rule that says a patented idea has to work, just that it can be constructed. Besides patent clerks are not in a position to judge the veracity of a patents claims.)
If you want to see a patent involving water used to boost the efficiency of an engine try this one GB2059501A. GB2107390A, describes water injected before the intake valve.
Find me the HHO patents.
- HHO (more properly written as H20) is other wise known as water - water gas is steam, and will not help anything burn more efficiently (water is used to put out fires after all)
Re: HHO Gas Cars 
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