2 beetles, caterpillar and something else for ID

[djeyewater]

A few from today for ID if anyone can help:

#1 About 3mm maybe?


#2 About 2mm I think


#3 I think this is a Darkling beetle Lagria hirta but would appreciate confirmation/correcting if I am wrong.


#4 Body about 12mm long. I am guessing it turns into a really plain brown moth?


Thanks,

Dave

[CapAndBracket]

The caterpillar is a vapourer Orgyia antiqua.

Cheers J.P.

[djeyewater]

Thanks, I'd never seen such a wierd looking caterpillar before (although I've not seen a lot of caterpillars). Looks like I was close with my guess about what it turns into.

Dave

[oxycera]

Lagria hirta is ok

[Pudding4brains]

Hi All,

Nr.1 looks like some flea beetle, maybe a Longitarsus sp.? (Reminds me somewhat of Longitarsus jacobaeae anyway)


Nr.2 should be some "hopper".

For both Nr1 and Nr2 you'll probably need to come up with a name for the host plant if you want to stick a name on them - but I'm no expert in either group.

Originally Posted by oxycera

Lagria hirta is ok

Hi Oxycera - that's cool - how do you tell these apart from Lagria atripes? The beetle people on a dutch forum seem to be reluctant to do that (they specialize in other groups though)... would be neat to know

Cheers, Arp

P.S. For Oxycera: Can you this one too?

[oxycera]

[quote]

Originally Posted by pudding4brains

hi All,

How Do You Tell These Apart From lagria Atripes

I don't, I didn't realise that was an option; what's the lowdown on L.atripes then?

[Pudding4brains]

Hi Oxycera,

Neat trick with the capitals in the quote ... also, I don't get the original quoted text (mine) when I quote you ... peculiar ... :?

Originally Posted by oxycera

I don't, I didn't realise that was an option; what's the lowdown on L.atripes then?

Ahw, okay, that's a shame ... if I had the lowdown I wouldn't be asking Just know from reading along that the 'standard' answer usually is something like: "I think this is species X but I really can't tell from photo" - suggesting that there is at least some "jizz" difference going on and that they suspect others, with more experience with the critters, might be able to tell them apart...

Oh well, I'll try to find out more next time

Thanks for the answer though!
Cheers, Arp

[Paul mabbott]

[quote=oxycera;304918]

I don't, I didn't realise that was an option; what's the lowdown on L.atripes then?

There is only one British Lagria species - which makes life a lot easier!

[Pudding4brains]

Originally Posted by Paul mabbott

There is only one British Lagria species - which makes life a lot easier!

Hmmmm ... in my defense ... I did check with FE, but obviously they're not the most reliable source (yet?).

What would be a good public access place for checklists of British beetles instead Paul?

Arp

P.S. Any thoughts on the Leaf Beetle?

[oxycera]

I'm not first and foremost a coleopterist so I'll just let this one lie.
No idea how I managed the trick with the Capitals

[Paul mabbott]

http://www.coleopterist.org.uk/checklist2008%20A5.pdf

The other beetle is a flea-beetle but I wouldn't like to say which.

However I've been looking further into the Lagria spp and find that Hodge & Jones note: "Lagria atripes 10-12 mm, resembling a large L. hirta. East Kent and Hampshire, rare."
So, as I may have mentioned before, we really do need to know the lengths of these insects!

Originally Posted by Pudding4brains

Hmmmm ... in my defense ... I did check with FE, but obviously they're not the most reliable source (yet?).

What would be a good public access place for checklists of British beetles instead Paul?

Arp

P.S. Any thoughts on the Leaf Beetle?

[djeyewater]

#1 Thanks for the ID. I just checked what plant it was on (its actually still on the same plant now) and I'm pretty sure its a ragwort, so I think it must be Longitarsus jacobaeae.

#2 It was on some grass, here's a pic of the grass it was on (actually I think its still there about ⅓ into the image from the left).

Sorry I don't know what type of grass it is - do you need this to help ID? I could probably get the grass ID'd in the plants forum here if it would help.

#3 Thanks for the confirmation. I'm in East Midlands and there were 2 of these on the same area of plants so I'm pretty sure it must be Lagria hirta. I think it was about 1cm long.

#4 Thanks for the ID and the info as well.

Dave

[Pudding4brains]

Originally Posted by Paul mabbott

http://www.coleopterist.org.uk/checklist2008%20A5.pdf ...
However I've been looking further into the Lagria spp and find that Hodge & Jones note: "Lagria atripes 10-12 mm, resembling a large L. hirta. East Kent and Hampshire, rare."
So, as I may have mentioned before, we really do need to know the lengths of these insects!

Cheers for that Paul - fine checklist that

Based on your additional Lagria info I would suspect mine to be L. atripes then, but I'll make sure to measure a few of these more exactly next time - any idea on the listed size for L. hirta? Much overlap?

Originally Posted by djeyewater

#1 Thanks for the ID. I just checked what plant it was on (its actually still on the same plant now) and I'm pretty sure its a ragwort, so I think it must be Longitarsus jacobaeae.

Well, there seems to be a close relative (also Longitarsus) that is more of an universalist food wise and is also known to feed on ragwort (but other plants as well) - will have to try and find that info again though - not even sure if it's a look-alike.

#2 It was on some grass, here's a pic of the grass it was on (actually I think its still there about ⅓ into the image from the left).

Sorry I don't know what type of grass it is - do you need this to help ID? I could probably get the grass ID'd in the plants forum here if it would help.

The type of grass won't help me any further in providing an "ID" - I totally do not know hoppers, I just do know that specialists are very reluctant with photo-IDs on most of the tiny ones and if they'll hazard one they usually want to know the plant it was on (or in the area). Sorry

Cheers! Arp

[Paul mabbott]

My copy of Joy gives L. hirta as 7-9 mms. It being the nature of the world, there is sure to be occasional overlap but for the majority of individuals the length seems definitive.

Originally Posted by Pudding4brains

Based on your additional Lagria info I would suspect mine to be L. atripes then, but I'll make sure to measure a few of these more exactly next time - any idea on the listed size for L. hirta? Much overlap?
Arp

[Pudding4brains]

Originally Posted by Paul mabbott

there is sure to be occasional overlap but for the majority of individuals the length seems definitive.

Cool!

Thanks for looking that up Paul!
Cheers, Arp

[CapAndBracket]

They are really interesting and easy to raise,(the vapourer that is) quite easy on food type, i use
bramble, when the eggs hatch they are tiny (mostly black hairs), they can spread out by ballooning like some spiders do, they spin a kind of web in which to pupate.
When they emerge the males are quite pretty and fast fliers, evolution has taken them on an unususal path in that the females are fligthless, virtually
lost their wings, they emerge and sit on their cocoon emitting pheremones
to attract a male for mating and lay thier eggs often on the cocoon. it's amazing how we rarely see the males but put a fresh emerged female by an open window and males will appear as from nowhere in minutes, those
pheramones sure are powerfull.

Cheers J.P.

[Tracey.A]

The closest thing I can find for the catterpillar is a moth called the vapourer, although the colour isn't right, but everything else is.

Tracey