Parking Fees for 4x4's

[lol geoff]

I've heard that one of the London Borough's is going to charge more for parking a large vehicle like a 4x4 than smaller vehicles..... I would have thought that it would be better to charge them less as an incentive to leave them parked, isn't it only when they are on the move that they allegedly do the most damage?

[Amber]

When you have to walk in the road to get past a 4x4 that's been parked on the pavement (regularly happens with same car, same place in Stoke and walking with a crutch, have no choice!), or if it's correctly parked, is so wide that other road vehicles cannot pass (heaven help the owner if it's an ambulance for them that can't get past!), I can understand the need to make life difficult for the owners.

The majority seem to be parked so as to occupy 1 and a half spaces in a car park, carry one baby in a baby seat at the back and never leave tarmac (or the drive if there's snow in the air), what are they but status symbols?

Carl told me that when he was a child, their family (5) would have a day out in a mini cooper - hardly a people carrier.

[Paul mabbott]

Originally Posted by lol geoff

I've heard that one of the London Borough's is going to charge more for parking a large vehicle like a 4x4 than smaller vehicles..... I would have thought that it would be better to charge them less as an incentive to leave them parked, isn't it only when they are on the move that they allegedly do the most damage?

Richmond and other boroughs are working on it. Good idea to keep them parked off road - preferably out of London. My own inclination would be to ban them entirely from built-up areas ..... Good signs, though, that there has actually been a downturn in sales of these beasts last year.

[MalcolmX]

Originally Posted by Paul mabbott

Richmond and other boroughs are working on it. Good idea to keep them parked off road - preferably out of London. My own inclination would be to ban them entirely from built-up areas ..... Good signs, though, that there has actually been a downturn in sales of these beasts last year.

I own and use daily a landcruser Amazon and I find it a very safe and convenient mode of transport. Most of the arguments against 4x4 are based on the politics of envy and not sound reasoning. Why are we the target of the green lobby what about old cars busses and vans that belch out rubbish daily. It seems that if you start an argument with or use the phrase climate change or global warming then the argument must be valid
I find most of these arguments are specious at best and based on very unsound science

[Paul mabbott]

They use relatively large amounts of fuel; they take up unnecessary space; they use up large amounts of raw material for no obvious need. There are rules about roadworthiness of 'buses - certainly your description doesn't fit most modern fleets; and buses carry large numbers of people in comparison to the one or two passengers commonly seen in tractors.
'Safety' tend to be used by some motorists to mean their personal safety - certainly doesn't extend to cyclists, pedestrians and other road users.
Why do you need to use one in town?

Originally Posted by MalcolmX

I own and use daily a landcruser Amazon and I find it a very safe and convenient mode of transport. Most of the arguments against 4x4 are based on the politics of envy and not sound reasoning. Why are we the target of the green lobby what about old cars busses and vans that belch out rubbish daily. It seems that if you start an argument with or use the phrase climate change or global warming then the argument must be valid
I find most of these arguments are specious at best and based on very unsound science

[nightshade]

I seem to remember that on French toll roads the 4x4s were
charged the same as trucks and possibly taxed as such

[John]

Originally Posted by MalcolmX

I own and use daily a landcruser Amazon and I find it a very safe and convenient mode of transport. Most of the arguments against 4x4 are based on the politics of envy and not sound reasoning. Why are we the target of the green lobby what about old cars busses and vans that belch out rubbish daily. It seems that if you start an argument with or use the phrase climate change or global warming then the argument must be valid
I find most of these arguments are specious at best and based on very unsound science

No disrespect to you Malcolm but if you were to take a straw poll of motorists views of the use of 4x4's the vast majority wouldn't understand why the need to have them for city use.

For the purpose they were designed for they are great but how many people that own one bought one for that reason. Not that many I bet.

I agree with Paul on his analysis of the 4x4 and, for me personally, I see no real use of a vehicle of that size in built up areas.

The Car Tax has been designed to tax those that are using larger cars already so I suppose it is a double edged sword to bring out another form of tax but there are larger cars that just don't take up the room of a 4x4 so I suppose there is good reason to bring in this charge.

John

[honeybee]

Originally Posted by MalcolmX

I own and use daily a landcruser Amazon and I find it a very safe and convenient mode of transport. Most of the arguments against 4x4 are based on the politics of envy and not sound reasoning. Why are we the target of the green lobby what about old cars busses and vans that belch out rubbish daily. It seems that if you start an argument with or use the phrase climate change or global warming then the argument must be valid
I find most of these arguments are specious at best and based on very unsound science

I'm sick of seeing these immaculate blunder-buses in towns doing the school run or with one person in them. Fair enough if you need one for work purposes in the COUNTRYSIDE where it can get muddy. In towns they're a menace and they do use more fuel, take up more room and are unnecessary and a danger to pedestrians.

[lewisa]

Originally Posted by honeybee

they do use more fuel

Than what?

Which 4x4 are you referring to?

How efficient is the engine at burning fuel and lowering emissions as a result?



With the exception of weight for the road damage element of taxation, taxation based on class of vehicle is nonsensicle and far too simplistic an approach.

Taxation should be levied at the point of sale based on energy consumption during production. During lifetime use it should be based on fuel consumed and emisssions produced, which are two seperate issues.


I dont own a 4x4, nor do I like them, but I disagree with the blanket ostracization, its conviction by association.

[Paul mabbott]

Originally Posted by lewisa

Than what?

Than a Smartcar at one end of the scale! Than any battery or hybrid car. Than many small diesels or even petrol ones.
Yes some are more energy-efficient than others but big cars are generally going to use more energy than small ones
I agree that taxation should be based on the criteria that you suggested and there should be serious differences along the scale ... at the moment the differential is not going to discourage any petrolhead ...