Fox hunting 'more popular' according to CA

[Jonathan]

Originally Posted by Jason Green

They didn't, or else it would be stopped now as was their wish. I'd opt to blame the ones who drew it up so slackly and won't alter it knowing of the abuse, to be more correct. I'm one of 'Those people' who supported its introduction, but obviously not fully now we know of these gaps.

As I said last night - it needs altering, or revoking then re-introducing if they can't/won't amend the existing bill. Simples!

I'm sorry Jason, I don't wish to sound harsh, but you should have found out more facts before you supported it. As I said, the hunting fraternity gave you fair warning, they said it was unworkable because they were fully aware of all the facts. If you chose to ignore them and believe a bunch of Labour MP's who wouldn't know a fox from a frog, then you only have yourselves to blame.

As for re-introducing a new Act - give us all a break! How much money and time did we waste on the first one? There are far more important issues concerning animal welfare than foxhunting.

Cheers
Jonathan

[Jason Green]

Originally Posted by Jonathan

I'm sorry Jason, I don't wish to sound harsh, but you should have found out more facts before you supported it. As I said, the hunting fraternity gave you fair warning, they said it was unworkable because they were fully aware of all the facts. If you chose to ignore them and believe a bunch of Labour MP's who wouldn't know a fox from a frog, then you only have yourselves to blame.
Cheers
Jonathan

This is 'Sport hunting' we're talking about here - foxhounds, horse-back, etc.? If so - why would I have listened to the 'Hunting fraternity' (for the sake of clarity I assume 'Sport' hunting here. If not, I don't suppose you can really say 'Legal' hunting either since those in the 'sport' would swear they are legal too - their dogs just run out of control and it not being their fault!) when it was the 'Hunting fraternity' who were the subject of this Act - vested interests and that. Not exactly unbiased are they!!

I must admit I wasn't too aware of the contents of the bill as it was written up and mobilised back then - I didn't sign a petition but more morally supported it, it's since joining this forum I've become more aware of country issues - but would have read from a range of sources, listened to the for and against on here, etc.

[Jonathan]

Originally Posted by Jason Green

I must admit I wasn't too aware of the contents of the bill as it was written up and mobilised back then - I didn't sign a petition but more morally supported it, it's since joining this forum I've become more aware of country issues - but would have read from a range of sources, listened to the for and against on here, etc.

To be honest Jason I think so many lies were told on both sides (pro and anti-foxhunting) that the average 'guy in the street' didn't know what to believe! It's probably unfair of me to suggest you should have found out more facts.

I've heard more tosh spoken or written about hunting than almost any other subject. From hunters who suggest a fox is quickly killed by 'a swift bite to the neck', to antis who claim to have seen a fox dragging two (90lb!) foxhounds around attached to it's back end, or those who swear they've seen hares released from cages at the Waterloo Cup - it's all clap-trap.

If I remember rightly there was a 'middle way' advocated by many people on both sides of the argument, which sounded reasonable to me. Some of the worst apects of hunting (competitive coursing and some terrier work for instance) would be banned, whilst allowing foxhunting to carry on, allbeit in a, hopefully, more cruelty-conscious manner. Personally, I think this might have worked, but it would have meant compromise on both sides and, in the end, winning the battle meant more than the welfare of any fox to many of those involved.

Cheers
Jonathan

[BillyPilgrim]

Originally Posted by jazz_11

i am for all kinds of hunting and shooting my father used to shoot and thats where i get my passion from, the fun aspect comes from your filedcraft not just pulling the trigger, i had my first opportunity to shoot pheasant last week which is sport not pest control, that was good fun...

i would like to hear your views

thanks for reading

jazz

How about swapping the gun for a camera?

That way you can still employ and enhance your fieldcraft skills. Which after all is the real fun and challenging part?

At the same time you would learn the art of photography, capture the beauty of the bird with an image you can keep for life and allow other people to do the same thing, over and over again.

[wizzo]

I suppose that living in the South West I qualify as a "southern softy" (what piffle). This argument has been done to death over the years. I know enough people in the hunting and shooting fraternity to know that the only real reason they do what they do, is a love of killing things - period! To hear them talking about the kill in the local is appalling. There are those like me that hate the thought of killing anything and those like them, that love the mechanics of killing. It's really quite simple and consequently....un-resolvable.

[eeyore]

Originally Posted by wizzo

I suppose that living in the South West I qualify as a "southern softy" (what piffle). This argument has been done to death over the years. I know enough people in the hunting and shooting fraternity to know that the only real reason thay do what they do, is a love of killing things - period! There are those like me that hate the thought of killing anything and those like them, that love the mechanics of killing. It's really quite simple and consequently....un-resolvable.

with respect wizzo if thats really true then the people you know are borderline sociopaths who shouldnt be allowed anywhere near a firearm , let alone be granted a FAC

I know a number of hunters and keepers too and in my experience the motivation is rather more complex and varied than that. On the whole they may love the whole experience but killing things is only part of that (just as i also know a number of soilders who love soildering and being in UKAF , but on the whole they dont glory in taking life either)

I do agree that the argument has both been done to death and is unresolveable , but sweeping generalisations about the motivations of those involved dont help.

[RKB]

Originally Posted by wizzo

I know enough people in the hunting and shooting fraternity to know that the only real reason they do what they do, is a love of killing things - period!

If that were the case then it is much easier and cheaper to buy white mice from the pet shop and spend a happy hour with a mallett. So there must be more to it than that.

Perhaps worth lobbing in the notion that humans, especially men, are naturally predators. A domestic dog has no need to kill to eat, but something still makes it chase the rabbit.

[wizzo]

Nail on the head RKB. I can only comment about my own experience. I didn't mean to generalise - but I only do facts. Please don't misunderstand me though....it's just humans doing what a lot of humans like to do. It's not for me to say what's right or wrong but it's just not for me. As for mice and mallots - well I think that would be preferable to some of the activities that pass as 'sport'. It would be quicker and more humane! As I write, there are those that would probably think "what a great idea" I don't really kid myself that I'll ever change others opinions. I hope this thread doesn't degenerate into the usual anti/pro debate - so my apologies if I've taken things that way. As Mrs Trump says "It is what it is"

[Paul mabbott]

'More popular' than what, one wonders? Bear-baiting, cock-fighting?

There is no point in trying to rationalise such behaviour by talking about population control, ecological balance or the like. People who ride to hounds do it because they like seeing animals killed, torn apart by dogs &c.. If such perverted behaviour were advocated elsewhere its supporters would be locked up or given medical treatment.

[Picidae]

Originally Posted by RKB

Perhaps worth lobbing in the notion that humans, especially men, are naturally predators. A domestic dog has no need to kill to eat, but something still makes it chase the rabbit.

Likewise, domestic cats vis a vis birds/mammals/amphibians etc. But, a domestic dog, is/should be, easier to control and when used professionally, better trained than a cat. Unless of course its specifically trained to hunt and in that case, it's not about trying to control instinctive behaviour, rather the lack of desire to control trained behaviour by those that trained it.