Prognosis for flightless Magpie

[Dogghound]

Originally Posted by valleyforge

The time taken for the regrowth of damaged feathers is often underestimated.

Not really of much reference to this thread or magpies, but during autumn last year I caught a blackcap with no tail, I caught it a about tend days later and it had more or less regrown its entire tail. Obviously with smaller migratory birds regrowth will be quicker but a good example of just how quickly it can occur.

[valleyforge]

As a general rule, moult in larger birds tends to take correspondingly longer than in smaller birds, not least because they have larger feathers, but also because plumage tends to be replaced in a less rapid sequence than in the smaller species.

The actual rate of feather growth (that is how long it takes the feather to sprout to full length) though, in my experience does take around 10 - 14 days for primary or tail feathers in finches and similarly sized birds, and around 21 - 28 days for something the size of a corvid, or wood pigeon.

I haven't any hands-on experience with blackcaps, but is it possible Dogghound, that at first capture the old feathers had already begun to be pushed out by the first of the new tail feathers? That wouldn't therefore give any true indication of how long it may have had a possibly damaged tail if you caught it just in the final stages of renewal ... if you get my drift.

As an example however, in December last year I was driving in white-out brizzard conditions around midnight ... I was averaging only around 15 mph as it was quite difficult to discern where the road was, when a bird flew up directly in front of my lights, skittered momentarily on the windscreen before disappearing from sight over the roof.

I stopped, and with the aid of a torch found a blackbird ... in the minute or so it took for me to find and reach it, it had become frozen hard to the compacted snow on the road ... temperature was around -12 deg C or so.

Although I tried to lift it as gently and carefully as possible, I could feel the wing and tail feathers tearing along the length and at the tips as I did so.

To cut a long story short, the bird (a first winter male) survived, but it has taken until just a couple of weeks ago for the wing and tail feathers to be renewed entirely, so that only now can he sustain proper flight ... a bit too late now for soft release this year.

I appreciate that the trauma of the event probably slowed the process somewhat in his case, but I find that 9-10 months is not that uncommon a period for complete feather renewal in similar casualties.

So perhaps your observations and theory, though quite possibly valid, can't be extrapolated to all migratory species (thrushes for example)?

[Dogghound]

Originally Posted by valleyforge

As a general rule, moult in larger birds tends to take correspondingly longer than in smaller birds, not least because they have larger feathers, but also because plumage tends to be replaced in a less rapid sequence than in the smaller species.

The actual rate of feather growth (that is how long it takes the feather to sprout to full length) though, in my experience does take around 10 - 14 days for primary or tail feathers in finches and similarly sized birds, and around 21 - 28 days for something the size of a corvid, or wood pigeon.

I haven't any hands-on experience with blackcaps, but is it possible Dogghound, that at first capture the old feathers had already begun to be pushed out by the first of the new tail feathers? That wouldn't therefore give any true indication of how long it may have had a possibly damaged tail if you caught it just in the final stages of renewal ... if you get my drift.

As an example however, in December last year I was driving in white-out brizzard conditions around midnight ... I was averaging only around 15 mph as it was quite difficult to discern where the road was, when a bird flew up directly in front of my lights, skittered momentarily on the windscreen before disappearing from sight over the roof.

I stopped, and with the aid of a torch found a blackbird ... in the minute or so it took for me to find and reach it, it had become frozen hard to the compacted snow on the road ... temperature was around -12 deg C or so.

Although I tried to lift it as gently and carefully as possible, I could feel the wing and tail feathers tearing along the length and at the tips as I did so.

To cut a long story short, the bird (a first winter male) survived, but it has taken until just a couple of weeks ago for the wing and tail feathers to be renewed entirely, so that only now can he sustain proper flight ... a bit too late now for soft release this year.

I appreciate that the trauma of the event probably slowed the process somewhat in his case, but I find that 9-10 months is not that uncommon a period for complete feather renewal in similar casualties.

So perhaps your observations and theory, though quite possibly valid, can't be extrapolated to all migratory species (thrushes for example)?

Very informative infomation there Valleyforge .

The blackcap had shed its whole tail most likely as a result of a predator. This must have occurred close to me capturing of the bird (within 24 hours). The tail would naturally moult from the centre of the tail outwards two feathers at a time (centrifugal). Think I may have been misleading as the tail wasn't damaged, just a (probably unrelated) example of how fast some birds can regrow feathers.

As for thrushes that does seem quite long but im not used to injured birds moulting. Certainly young pulli blackbirds have a full (juv.) tail around two weeks which are noticably a lower quality feather than on an adult. Juv feathers need to be grown quick just to get out of the nest before the post juv moult. The moult of adults (complete post nuptial) is about a month and half to two months. This is in usual circumstances with new feathers pushing out loose old ones simultaneously. The migratory reference was more to do with the bird putting on fat and getting ready to migrate away rather than the nature of the bird. So perhaps birds about to migrate put more energy into feather re-growth than ones already wintering.

[faz]

P.S. Don’t worry, Faz, it never crossed my mind that valleyforge was advocating me to perform imping! [/quote]

[valleyforge]

Originally Posted by Dogghound

So perhaps birds about to migrate put more energy into feather re-growth than ones already wintering.

That seems like a reasonable conclusion.

[Hedgehoggy]

Originally Posted by valleyforge

As an example however, in December last year I was driving in white-out brizzard conditions around midnight ... I was averaging only around 15 mph as it was quite difficult to discern where the road was, when a bird flew up directly in front of my lights, skittered momentarily on the windscreen before disappearing from sight over the roof.

I stopped, and with the aid of a torch found a blackbird ... in the minute or so it took for me to find and reach it, it had become frozen hard to the compacted snow on the road ... temperature was around -12 deg C or so.

Although I tried to lift it as gently and carefully as possible, I could feel the wing and tail feathers tearing along the length and at the tips as I did so.

To cut a long story short, the bird (a first winter male) survived, but it has taken until just a couple of weeks ago for the wing and tail feathers to be renewed entirely, so that only now can he sustain proper flight ... a bit too late now for soft release this year.

What an incredible story. Not only did the blackbird survive being clipped by your car, but survived a stint of cryotherapy too! And if you hadn’t braved the elements and got out to search for him, and taken him to your warm sanctuary with regular meals....... One very, very lucky blackbird indeed .

Some very helpful info being bandied about here, from which I’ve learnt so much more about feather development than I would have done using google!

[Hedgehoggy]

Flightless magpie is still going strong He’s been integrating with 3 other magpies yesterday and today (?family unit) and one of the magpies repeatedly perched next to flightless one today (at first I thought it was going to attack the flightless one!).

Flightless maggy has been sharing his food stash with his friends, but he still gets the lion’s share as the other 3 take flight at the slightest movement they see from my windows!

Realistically, I think it’s unlikely he’ll manage to exist like this in the wild until his next moult late next year, but never say never! I’m hoping he might even regrow a few feathers soon, which may just be the boost he needs to afford him a little upwards flight.

Here he is taking a bath today (sorry pics are rubbish, taken through kitchen window and birdbath is a good 50 yards away)

[Hedgehoggy]

Magpie is still living a flightless life in my garden. He didn’t put in an appearance the morning after the fierce gales a few days ago and I assumed he’d perished during that storm, but he turned up mid-afternoon and made his way to the food I’d put out for him . After undoubtedly spending all night awake clinging onto a branch for dear life during that storm, he deserved a much needed lie in that morning!

I noticed one of the primary feathers on his good right wing looks about to fall out - ? damaged during the storm.

What are his chances of living like this until his next full moult? Has anybody else here experienced a scenario like this with a positive outcome?