Birds and Cats

Guinnessman1974 · #1 (**permalink**) 13-09-2011, 08:09 PM

Trying to get a clear answer on the damage that cats do to bird populations. Especially in urban areas.

Anyone have any clear data?

I've emailed the BTO, in particular with regard the 'Songbird Survival' charity website - who appear to be rather biased toward culling of Corvids and Badgers - however I feel that the large conservation organisations are just 'sitting on the fence' when it comes to stating how they feel about Cats!

Why is this?

The BTO seem rather vague.

Kayleigh · #2 (**permalink**) 13-09-2011, 08:14 PM

I don't know either it seems to be brushed under the carpet they don't know the real numbers as the cats are let out and not monitored how many birds are killed by cats..
You cant even have a proper discussion on the issues without getting into hot water..

Adam Cheeseman · #3 (**permalink**) 13-09-2011, 08:22 PM

I can't state the sources but there are apparently 9 million cats in the country who average about 6 kills each per year = 54,000,000 birds each year. Obviously some kill fewer, others more.

Cheers,

Adam

Ukwildlifeo · #4 (**permalink**) 13-09-2011, 08:29 PM

There is a paper on this (cant find it at the mo) where owners were asked to report kills. I think the general consensus (simplfied) was common birds (ie robin) reproduce enough to compensate for cat kills. The figure Adam has quoted was a conservative estimate based on the kills seen by owners, the numbers killed are alarming and it makes you wonder about the effect rarer and less prolific species.

I'd love to see a survey on the effect of slowworms other reptiles and amphibians. There is plenty of ancedotal eveidence of cats causing local extinctions as unlike birds, they can't fly back in to repopulate an area.

Adam Cheeseman · #5 (**permalink**) 13-09-2011, 08:54 PM

When I used to have a cat, he brought in birds, frogs, squirrels and a bat. God knows what he didn't bring in.

Cheers,

Adam

Jim Ford · #6 (**permalink**) 13-09-2011, 09:25 PM

I was at a bat conservation meeting some years ago when a case was mentioned of a rare bat colony having been wiped out by a single cat. There was a tree branch near the roost exit and the cat used to sit on it and kill every bat that exited.

Jim

rossy · #7 (**permalink**) 13-09-2011, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ukwildlifeo

There is a paper on this (cant find it at the mo) where owners were asked to report kills. I think the general consensus (simplfied) was common birds (ie robin) reproduce enough to compensate for cat kills. The figure Adam has quoted was a conservative estimate based on the kills seen by owners, the numbers killed are alarming and it makes you wonder about the effect rarer and less prolific species.

I'd love to see a survey on the effect of slowworms other reptiles and amphibians. There is plenty of ancedotal eveidence of cats causing local extinctions as unlike birds, they can't fly back in to repopulate an area.

i read its around 110 million, with 55 million of those birds, its an unbelievable figure, its got to be a serious issue, and like stated by the op, they blame corvids, which is absloute nonsense, there lies the problem with your garden birds. its without doubt CATS AS THE STATS BACK IT UP. rossy.

tigertom · #8 (**permalink**) 13-09-2011, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rossy

i read its around 110 million, with 55 million of those birds, its an unbelievable figure, its got to be a serious issue, and like stated by the op, they blame corvids, which is absloute nonsense, there lies the problem with your garden birds. its without doubt CATS AS THE STATS BACK IT UP. rossy.

Birds in europe have lived with cats for a very long time Felis silvestris (wild cats). Felis catus (domestic cats) is just one sub sp, wildcats are still widespead in many parts of europe and in the main birds are well able to cope with predertation from cats.
edit the figure you quoted are they british or from america.

tigertom · #9 (**permalink**) 13-09-2011, 11:57 PM

Some cat facts

According to a recent survey by the mammal society, birds comprise only a small proportion about 20% of all the creatures caught by cats. most of the catches are of mice and voles.

There is approx 8 millon cats in the uk plus feral cats.
Cats are individuals: there behaviour varies widely. Some will be prolific hunters some never catch any thing.

Town cats live at far higher densities than those in the country and allthogh Town cats will catch fewer pray than country cats there pray will have a higher proportion of birds than those in the country.

Most cats are opportunist hunters they will hunt what ever they come across rather than actively hunting a particular species.

aeshna5 · #10 (**permalink**) 14-09-2011, 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tigertom

Birds in europe have lived with cats for a very long time Felis silvestris (wild cats). Felis catus (domestic cats) is just one sub sp, wildcats are still widespead in many parts of europe and in the main birds are well able to cope with predertation from cats.
edit the figure you quoted are they british or from america.

The big difference between true wild cats + domestic cats is population density. The latter in urban/suburban areas are at an extremely high unnatural level which can impact on species , especially sedentary species such as reptiles.