help me identify this bird!

sparkle14 · #1 (**permalink**) 24-02-2007, 10:07 AM

Hello to you all. I live in Bexhill on sea, and this morning discovered a dead bird on the beach. It was quite large, about 35-40 cm long, grey and white plumage, sharp looking straight bill about 8-10cm long. the strangest thing was that as I looked for any sign of a ring on its legs, I saw that the bird had distinctive green and black vertical striped (long) legs.I cannot find anything with legs like this in my books. Also, should I report this to the rspb, due to the avian flu problem? thankyou to anyone who replies. Tracey

nightshade · #2 (**permalink**) 24-02-2007, 11:12 AM

It has me beat,no image possible?

GuyF · #3 (**permalink**) 24-02-2007, 11:26 AM

Sounds a bit like a Greenshank but those legs sound very strange, so not sure.
Guy

sparkle14 · #4 (**permalink**) 24-02-2007, 02:29 PM

The only bird with green legs, as you say, is a greenshank!! However, the stripes have me foxed!! My dad thinks it may have been a foreign bird off course. We had a lot of stormy weather a day or so ago, and a lot of other debris on the beach. Poor bird. Its a shame.

John · #5 (**permalink**) 24-02-2007, 02:51 PM

The first thing we need to know is if it is actually a wader. It certainly sounds like one and the only Western Palearctic to even come close to that I also think is a Greenshank, although the size you give would be a bit too large for one. Their maximum size would be about 34cm. I'm not sure about bill length but a Greenshank bill would have a slight upcurve to it. Did you notice what colour the bill was.

There is an excellent image of one in the gallery by fisher. Here it is. See what you think of it.
http://www.wildaboutbritain.co.uk/ga...age-20673.html

The only waders I can think of that are that size are the winter plumaged Godwits, both Black & Bar-tailed but they don't have green legs. The only other largeish long billed waders I can think of are the Dowitchers but they are even smaller than a Greenshank, but they do have greenish legs.

John

nightshade · #6 (**permalink**) 24-02-2007, 04:16 PM

Could it have had varicose veins

I tried a google search using the description given
(in various combinations)but got cranes and greenshanks

Wild-Woman · #7 (**permalink**) 24-02-2007, 04:51 PM

Perhaps the colouration is caused by rigor mortis after it's passing. The blood may have collected in the legs length and made it appear like it's got a stripe. Just an idea.

sparkle14 · #8 (**permalink**) 24-02-2007, 07:36 PM

i went back for another look, but something had begun to eat the bird. This tells me that it must have only been on the beach a little while, and not dead for long, because I am always finding half eaten gulls. Lots of dogs in the area. The only bits left were wings and feet, still stripy! The feet were webbed, and the stripes extended to the claws, which were short. so not sure about the greenshank. Also the couloring was more similar to a gull!! But far too big.The bill was a whitish grey clour, and no upturn to it, very straight. Varicose veins is a definite possibility

John · #9 (**permalink**) 24-02-2007, 07:47 PM

Is there no way you could take a photo of what is left as I am a tad bit confused now.

John

GuyF · #10 (**permalink**) 24-02-2007, 07:51 PM

Does seem a bit confusing because as far as I know greenshanks don't have webbed feet. I'll keep thinking about it and see if I can find anything.
Guy

Wild-Woman · #11 (**permalink**) 24-02-2007, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuyF

Does seem a bit confusing because as far as I know greenshanks don't have webbed feet. I'll keep thinking about it and see if I can find anything.
Guy

Could it be a domestic bird of some sort? I once found a dead piglet on he beach!

badgerwatcher · #12 (**permalink**) 24-02-2007, 08:18 PM

This is Marsh Sandpiper as an example, from Birds of the Western Palearctic, showing that vertical stripes on legs might be where bones show different colouration to decaying flesh between bones, if you see what I mean.

John · #13 (**permalink**) 24-02-2007, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by badgerwatcher

This is Marsh Sandpiper as an example, from Birds of the Western Palearctic, showing that vertical stripes on legs might be where bones show different colouration to decaying flesh between bones, if you see what I mean.

The problem is the webbed feet description as well as the size being given. Unless someone knows differently there isn't a wader with webbed feet and I can't think of another species of bird with long legs and a long beak with webbed feet and also the size that has been mentioned.

The only waders that reach the size stated are Slender-billed Curlew (I wish), Woodcock, Black and Bar-tailed Godwit, Whimbrel, Greenshank, Oystercatcher, Black-winged Stilt. (Curlew and Avocet are much bigger).

Using that size then the gulls falling in that catergory would have small bills in relation to the 8-10 cms sited so it can't be a Gull (unless a mistake has been made).

Take waders and gulls out of the equation and what have you left. Well, actually, nothing.

If this was April 1st I would have an answer but it isn't and I am totally flumaxed and intrigued. How about you aeshna5. What's your thoughts?

John

badgerwatcher · #14 (**permalink**) 24-02-2007, 09:36 PM

Yes, I was trying to post the picture while the webbed feet were introduced, John, so that changes it completely.
I have no idea.

sparkle14 · #15 (**permalink**) 25-02-2007, 06:47 AM

I really am not pulling anyones leg!!! I so wish i had a camera with me the first time!!

Is it possible that it has come from foreign parts and got itself lost? Or are you very clever people experts on marine birds from around the world? I DID have to estimate the sizes, but having been back a second time (with camera)I think I was roughly correct. The legs were not AS long as I had previously thought. However, like I said, the poor thing had been half eaten by that time, so no point in taking pics. I spent all day yesterday researching, and the closest I could find was a white egret, however, no webbed feet!! Would birds cross breed??

aeshna5 · #16 (**permalink**) 25-02-2007, 07:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John

The problem is the webbed feet description as well as the size being given. Unless someone knows differently there isn't a wader with webbed feet and I can't think of another species of bird with long legs and a long beak with webbed feet and also the size that has been mentioned.

The only waders that reach the size stated are Slender-billed Curlew (I wish), Woodcock, Black and Bar-tailed Godwit, Whimbrel, Greenshank, Oystercatcher, Black-winged Stilt. (Curlew and Avocet are much bigger).

Using that size then the gulls falling in that catergory would have small bills in relation to the 8-10 cms sited so it can't be a Gull (unless a mistake has been made).

Take waders and gulls out of the equation and what have you left. Well, actually, nothing.

If this was April 1st I would have an answer but it isn't and I am totally flumaxed and intrigued. How about you aeshna5. What's your thoughts?

John

John- it left me baffled too + I couldn't usefully have added anything that the others hadn't said- but the webbed feet would rule out a wader! Did you have the birthday weekend birding trip you said you were going for?

sparkle14 · #17 (**permalink**) 25-02-2007, 07:08 AM

Hi again!! I think I have just found my bird!!! It looked remarkably like a Gannet! The only thing would still be the stripy legs, however, I think we have to assume that some kind of discolouration after death had occurred. What do you guys think??

John · #18 (**permalink**) 25-02-2007, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sparkle14

Hi again!! I think I have just found my bird!!! It looked remarkably like a Gannet! The only thing would still be the stripy legs, however, I think we have to assume that some kind of discolouration after death had occurred. What do you guys think??

A Gannet?
You do realise that a Gannet is more than twice the sizes you gave us and is a very big bird with squat type thick legs. Almost a conical longish beak and that there is no other bird like it on this side of the ocean.

There is nothing in your original description that even hints at a Gannet.

I see you went back with a camera the second time. Did you take any photos. I hope so as I am totally intrigued by this bird. If you have, upload some into the forum images gallery then add them to this thread. It would satisfy a few peoples curiosity.

John

John · #19 (**permalink**) 25-02-2007, 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aeshna5

John- it left me baffled too + I couldn't usefully have added anything that the others hadn't said- but the webbed feet would rule out a wader! Did you have the birthday weekend birding trip you said you were going for?

No unfortunately I didn't.

It has been manic at work this week and to cap it all off I had to show 11 people around new homes on Friday then do the tenanacy agreements with them (I am a Housing Assistant standing in for the Officers who are on a course). Having done all that I had to write up a few things on Saturday in preparation for another 12 lets on Monday so basically the only thing I did yesterday was go to the shops for a paper and some groceries.

What do you think of this gannet ID?

John

aeshna5 · #20 (**permalink**) 25-02-2007, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John

No unfortunately I didn't.

It has been manic at work this week and to cap it all off I had to show 11 people around new homes on Friday then do the tenanacy agreements with them (I am a Housing Assistant standing in for the Officers who are on a course). Having done all that I had to write up a few things on Saturday in preparation for another 12 lets on Monday so basically the only thing I did yesterday was go to the shops for a paper and some groceries.

What do you think of this gannet ID?

John

Sorry you didn't get out much John- maybe next w/e? As for the possible Gannet- I think we may have to take the original lengths with a pinch of salt- a lot of people are not very accurate when estimating lengths, especially if they are not used to measuring things.

I guess at least with the Gannet we have webbed feet + a long bill, though the legs are not that long + more blackish than green. Given Tracey's south coast location the mention of Gannet, made me wonder whether it could have been a Red-throated Diver, ignoring the lengths given, it is grey + white in winter plumage, has a relatively long + pointed bill with webbed feet, though again more greyish than green. They would be present offshore at this time of year.

Without a photo I guess we'll be stumbling around in the dark on this one!

jonesboy58 · #21 (**permalink**) 25-02-2007, 08:20 AM

This whole episode just goes to show how important the camera is for identification.Many moons ago(when digital was definately not about) when I first started birding I drew for myself an outline of duck/passerine/warbler and a wader and so on. Then when I saw a bird I would draw on the picture what I saw eg eye stripes and colours bill size and at my leisure look them up.Just trying to remember a bird is a very difficult thing to do.
People who have just started out birding or have just a casual interest can summon up all manner of descriptions(no disrespect to anyone we have ALL been there).
So if you not armed with your camera stop and think and try to remember all the things that really stickout about this bird you are looking at.
Carry on Birding
Jonesboy

sparkle14 · #22 (**permalink**) 25-02-2007, 09:03 AM

Right, here goes!!! Armed with a picture of a gannet, I have just been back to the spot where I first spotted the bird. To my amazement, I found not one but TWO birds! The original one which i found yesterday morning, (still in one piece) plus a DIFFERENT bird which had been half eaten, which I found yesterday afternoon! They are definitely both gannets, a long way from home I would have thought!! The original one has got slight oranging to the head area, which I had put down to tar staining in the first place! And yes! I have learned my lesson about carrying a digital camera from now on. Thanks to all who replied, and tried to help. I still wonder what happened to my gannets, and why they died though. Would have preferred to spot them flying around. Just off to purchase binoculars.........

sparkle14 · #23 (**permalink**) 25-02-2007, 09:10 AM

And, yes, my original size were well underestimated John!!! Took a much closer look this morning, and also have some pics on my mobile phone, so I will try and upload them later if this site allows it. Thanks for replying!!!

badgerwatcher · #24 (**permalink**) 25-02-2007, 09:25 AM

At least now we know!
You can drive a bird watcher mad like that, you know!

sparkle14 · #25 (**permalink**) 25-02-2007, 10:14 AM

Sorry to anyone who I have driven insane!!! Im a relative beginner at birding, although holding a certificate in natural science, I ought to know better than to try and identify from memory!!! However, on the good side, you guys have got me hooked!!!! Im looking forward to many more years of identifying birds and wildlife,(hopefully more accurately).!! Wrists suitably slapped!!! Best wishes, Tracey