Walking in castles my new hobby !

Dan Salter · #1 (**permalink**) 20-01-2007, 09:33 PM

Ok i wanted to give the new meindl boots a stretch so took a walk around the lovely grounds of Leeds Castle ( my posh neighbours) today....just finished watching the falconry display and as i walked out home accross the estate/farmland i had a lovely close fly over from what im pretty sure was a hobby...had my bins too so i got a good close shot.

My question is....what do hobbys eat when the dragon flies are not around? do they just make do woth other insects?

vinnychameleon · #2 (**permalink**) 20-01-2007, 09:40 PM

Dan. Hope you enjoyed it

. As far as I know hobbies are only summer visitors. We have a pair that nest near here but they are never around during winter and they have normally left by the end of October. I could be wrong.

vinnychameleon · #3 (**permalink**) 20-01-2007, 09:43 PM

Oh yeh and did it have red around its legs and tail? My avatar is a Hobby if you wanna compare it with what you saw.

Dan Salter · #4 (**permalink**) 20-01-2007, 09:44 PM

well this is what i was thinking...in which case.....hmmm....see it had the beard? and my initial thought was peregrine ?....which would be my 3rd in my life in under 2 weeks?....

vinnychameleon · #5 (**permalink**) 20-01-2007, 09:50 PM

The other thing is hobbies have very long slender wings and are not as stocky as a peregrine. They kinda look like a swift in their outline.

Dan Salter · #6 (**permalink**) 20-01-2007, 09:55 PM

Yeah ...hmmm...im pretty sure it wasnt a peregrine having only seen two last week , i would have noticed the yellow on it as i was pretty close....
i guess it was either a merlin or a very pretty kestrel? it just seemd to have more of the bluegrayish tinge to its back and the more orangey to the underparts so i thought hobby but could have been a merlin which would have been a first ? also i cant guage size as it was very close and i was looking through my bins so it could have been small like a merlin...

ill write it of as a merlin..but more likely a pretty kestrel ha ha

vinnychameleon · #7 (**permalink**) 20-01-2007, 10:03 PM

Now you mention it I think it is almost definetely a merlin as if you look at photos the males have bluey grey blacks and orangey underparts. You lucky thing

I've only seen them twice before.

Lincs Yellowbelly · #8 (**permalink**) 20-01-2007, 10:07 PM

Would certainly say it was 100% not a Hobby, probably a Merlin or Kestrel as has been said

Deer Stalker · #9 (**permalink**) 20-01-2007, 10:07 PM

Does sound like a Merlin.

Dan Salter · #10 (**permalink**) 20-01-2007, 10:21 PM

Well....yes i have to agree with myself ha ha
See? im not a robin stroker....and i have been a raptor fan all my life...although only seen my first wild peregrine this year.
I had just minutes before been watching a falconry display flying a kestrel and well...i can tell one at a thousand paces.....same as a peregrine....
Im a bit sketchy with the hobby and merlin...saw several definate hobbies in the summer so recognise the blueygray colouring and orangey under......hence why i thought it was a hobby today....but then i thought? they eat dragonflies....wrong time of year surely?...cheered myself up by thinking maybe it was a peregrine after all and i didnt notice the yellow parts?...but i have only seen them over salt marsh around here?
Wasnt till earlier i started to think merlin? and it possibly looked bigger as he or she was so close anyway plus through my bins...i followed it unitl it went out of view so didnt get a real size view.

Would be nice as it would be my first merlin !

badgerwatcher · #11 (**permalink**) 21-01-2007, 10:40 AM

Castles are a bit of an interest of mine, Dan. Walmer castle has very nice grounds for walking, and woodland, as well as being next to a really interesting stretch of beach, Deal is smaller, good, but closed in winter months, very small 'grounds', Dover is my favourite, quite likely to see peregrines there, green woodpeckers and other birds. Good for wild flowers too. All three coastal.

badgerwatcher · #12 (**permalink**) 21-01-2007, 10:48 AM

And of course they all have events such as battle re-enactments, falconry displays, shakespeare performances and Walmer has all sorts of arts and crafts type days. Dover castle was also used recently for the filming of The Other Boleyn Girl.

badgerwatcher · #13 (**permalink**) 21-01-2007, 10:52 AM

Richborough (ruins) is also well worth a visit, and is near Sandwich Bay bird observatory, which is a good place worth investigating.

aeshna5 · #14 (**permalink**) 21-01-2007, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan Salter

Ok i wanted to give the new meindl boots a stretch so took a walk around the lovely grounds of Leeds Castle ( my posh neighbours) today....just finished watching the falconry display and as i walked out home accross the estate/farmland i had a lovely close fly over from what im pretty sure was a hobby...had my bins too so i got a good close shot.

My question is....what do hobbys eat when the dragon flies are not around? do they just make do woth other insects?

They take a lot of birds, even in the summer, as well as large insects. They are good at chasing Swifts, Swallows + near me they regularly take Starlings . They nearly all disappear by late September on route to Africa, but have just read of one seen in December as well as other unseasonal birds such as various warblers, Swallows + House Martins. Could your bird have been a male Sparrowhawk? They are grey above with chestnut barring. Maybe Merlin male as others have suggested?

Paul mabbott · #15 (**permalink**) 21-01-2007, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vinnychameleon

Dan. Hope you enjoyed it

. As far as I know hobbies are only summer visitors. We have a pair that nest near here but they are never around during winter and they have normally left by the end of October. I could be wrong.

Don't merlins appear when the hobbies go (and vice versa)? In that case, the question is, what do merlins eat in the winter?

Small birds presumably?

Paul mabbott · #16 (**permalink**) 21-01-2007, 02:09 PM

Is that the Leeds in Kent?
Castle keeps are good because they give you a tremendous view over the neighbourhood (and further) - especially if they themselves are on a high spot - more impressive ones in Yorkshire of course (not to mention Castleton).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan Salter

Ok i wanted to give the new meindl boots a stretch so took a walk around the lovely grounds of Leeds Castle ( my posh neighbours) today..............

Dan Salter · #17 (**permalink**) 21-01-2007, 03:52 PM

Yes Leeds in kent which is where i live next tot he castle.

And no definately not a male sparrowhawk.
Im sure it was either a lingering Hobby or a merlin.

Gill Catton · #18 (**permalink**) 22-01-2007, 09:31 AM

Could the falconer not have been excersizing another bird after the show? Or lost one? Merlins are small, that would probably be the second thought on seeing one after 'oh look there's a bird of prey' if it seemed suprisingly small (and usually very fast) then it may have been a merlin (they mainly small birds but I have seen one in a photo with a vole and it seems likely that they would take insects in the summer). Very very unlikely to be a truly wild hobby they're just not around at this time of year.
Plus to me the Hobby seems strikingly smart and black and white, the upper parts blue/ black rather than blue/ grey and with a definate dark red brown around the legs, are you sure it's not merlin you've seen before? I have seen them a couple of times hunting around lakes. The moustache though is a much stronger feature in a hobby than in a merlin where it's more of the suggestion of a moustache - alike a teenagers attempt at a moustache!!....

What about a juv peregrine? no yellow bits yet? Although a juv would be in mostly adult plumage by now (so the blue grey still works) the colour of the fleshy bits is often the last to mature

aeshna5 · #19 (**permalink**) 22-01-2007, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul mabbott

Don't merlins appear when the hobbies go (and vice versa)? In that case, the question is, what do merlins eat in the winter?

Small birds presumably?

Not quite. Merlins are resident in UK, but in summer restricted mainly to uplands, so in many parts of UK Merlins do appear, as Hobbies disappear to warmer climes. Many of our breeding
Merlins move to estuaries + open land at lower altitudes for the winter, joined by birds from Scandinavia + other parts of northern Europe.

Meadow Pipits are probably most frequent prey item, but finches, Skylarks, Starlings + other open countryside small birds are regularly taken.

Dan Salter · #20 (**permalink**) 22-01-2007, 11:31 AM

To be honest im so confused now i dont know what i saw but it WASNT a kestrel thats all i can safely say.

And i was on the outskirts of the castle estate heading home accross chalky hills...the bird came from my home direction toward the castle....And the falconer had locked up all birds and finisheds the show by the time i left...he only flew an owl and a kestrel as it was way too windy.

Oh well....ill just class it as un identified.
I have seen several hobbies.....Could one still be lingering due to climate change? lets face it.....i drove past a row of seven fully open dafs just now on way to college.,

Dan

aeshna5 · #21 (**permalink**) 22-01-2007, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan Salter

To be honest im so confused now i dont know what i saw but it WASNT a kestrel thats all i can safely say.

And i was on the outskirts of the castle estate heading home accross chalky hills...the bird came from my home direction toward the castle....And the falconer had locked up all birds and finisheds the show by the time i left...he only flew an owl and a kestrel as it was way too windy.

Oh well....ill just class it as un identified.
I have seen several hobbies.....Could one still be lingering due to climate change? lets face it.....i drove past a row of seven fully open dafs just now on way to college.,

Dan

Dan, all birders get those birds that get away without a proper ID + it's always frustrating, especially if you feel it could have been something special!

Am I right that you're in Kent- if you are you must get to Harty Ferry/ Capel Fleet on Sheppey- probably best place in south for raptors with good chance of Merlin, Peregrine, Marsh + Hen Harriers, there's currently Rough-legged Buzzard, Short-eared + Barn Owl. Elmley also worth checking for raptors as well as hoardes of duck, waders,etc.

Dan Salter · #22 (**permalink**) 23-01-2007, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aeshna5

Dan, all birders get those birds that get away without a proper ID + it's always frustrating, especially if you feel it could have been something special!

Am I right that you're in Kent- if you are you must get to Harty Ferry/ Capel Fleet on Sheppey- probably best place in south for raptors with good chance of Merlin, Peregrine, Marsh + Hen Harriers, there's currently Rough-legged Buzzard, Short-eared + Barn Owl. Elmley also worth checking for raptors as well as hoardes of duck, waders,etc.

Cheers Aesh but i go to both capel and elmley regularly...Was there last weekend. Saw my first peregrine ( 2) have seen tonne of marsh harriers, hobby in summer, barn owls, kestrel etc etc...So i do know my raptors which is why this bird has thrown me as im still sure it was a hobby ha ha...Incidently the rough legged didnt show when i was there last week. (or maybe weekend before i cant remember)

Gill Catton · #23 (**permalink**) 23-01-2007, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan Salter

Cheers Aesh but i go to both capel and elmley regularly...Was there last weekend. Saw my first peregrine ( 2) have seen tonne of marsh harriers, hobby in summer, barn owls, kestrel etc etc...So i do know my raptors which is why this bird has thrown me as im still sure it was a hobby ha ha...Incidently the rough legged didnt show when i was there last week. (or maybe weekend before i cant remember)

really don't think it could be a lingering hobby - a brain damaged one with no migration instinct maybe

In my book ( the concise birds of the western palearctic) there is only pink colour (summer range) over the whole of Europe, they winter in southern Africa and I think January is pushing it for lingering this far north of it's winter destination -
my money's on a juv pergrine if it had a nice obvious moustache

aeshna5 · #24 (**permalink**) 23-01-2007, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gill Catton

really don't think it could be a lingering hobby - a brain damaged one with no migration instinct maybe

In my book ( the concise birds of the western palearctic) there is only pink colour (summer range) over the whole of Europe, they winter in southern Africa and I think January is pushing it for lingering this far north of it's winter destination -
my money's on a juv pergrine if it had a nice obvious moustache

I agree Gill it's very unlikely, but there's a report of one in Norfolk for December in the county sightings in latest Birdwatch magazine along with all sorts of migrants that should have been in Africa including various warblers, hirundines, Turtle Dove, etc.

With Hobbies taking small birds they shouldn't starve if they decide to stay.

Gill Catton · #25 (**permalink**) 23-01-2007, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aeshna5

I agree Gill it's very unlikely, but there's a report of one in Norfolk for December in the county sightings in latest Birdwatch magazine along with all sorts of migrants that should have been in Africa including various warblers, hirundines, Turtle Dove, etc.

With Hobbies taking small birds they shouldn't starve if they decide to stay.

Really that is interesting..... god who know's what's going to happen over the next few years!!!

Have often wondered by birds bother to migrate when a food source is still present, have never quite figured out either why some of our passerines migrate to Europe to be replaced by those from further north of the same species which presumably utilise the same food resource..... Why do 'ours' decide to move rather than stay and defend?
Perhaps there's some sort of gentleman's agreement