Red Kites causing serious problems

[FUDGEY]

Ive just recieved information regarding predation on many different types of waders chicks in my area. Lapwings, snipe, curlew, oystercatcher, redshank and also many species of ducks like goosander, merganser, teal, mallard, pintail, shoveller etc. Other birds affected are common gull (not so common in my neck) pheasants, partridge, skylark, meadow pipit and there will be a lot more. One piece of marshland that had 8 broods of lapwing, 3 snipe, 2 redshank an oystercatcher and curlew does not have a single chick left at it today. The culprits? Red Kites! Now I love my raptors, but they are going to have a serious affect on many birds. The news is being brought to the RSPBs attention tomorrow, I wonder what their response will be. Not looking good at all. Once again interfering by intoducing higher numbers into an area than there should be looks to be having serious knock on affects. I can't even think what can be possibly done to prevent this and serious concerns are being raised on the damage that will be done when they spread to Dumfries and Galloways wader strong holds, namely Mersehead reserve and Carlaverock reserve. This is not assumptions, a lot of Kites have been seen taking these waders and the marsh I said about that had all the chicks taken has had 2 kites working the ground almost every daylight minute and the farmer has witnessed many kills. Another bloke who lives on the banks of loch ken has had his entire duck and chicken chicks taken by them too. Loch Kens levels are very low at the moment and the exposed chicks on the mud flats make easy pickings. I know Kites aren't responsible for them all, but it looks like they are having the biggest impact on the predation. What's your take on it? Personally I love the kites, but I think this shows the artificial feeding site has gave my area an unhealthy, un-natural population.

[RKB]

I'm sorry, but this isn't good enough evidence of anything. Anecdotal evidence is notoriously poor ("a farmer says...", "my friend's ducks..."). You'd need to give documented predation rates by kites and productivity of the prey species in conjunction with a control area for anyone to take it seriously. That might sound like a chore, but that's what makes scientific evidence more valuable than anecdotal evidence.

For instance, did you friend actually see a red kite take every single duckling and chick? I very much doubt it. People who work with kits rarely see any kills at all. You give a list of wader broods that amounts to 60 chicks. How many of those were actually seen to be taken by a Red kite?

[aeshna5]

I'm rather sceptical of this too.

[rossy]

after watching halcyon river diares and seeing the otter eat nearly all 10 mallard chicks , i wonder what predators that you have in the area fudgey, birds face an unbelievable battle in the survival stakes, and are constantly under threat from the air and on the ground, and as most of these are waders, must admit its pretty grim, do you have any mink , stoats , weasels, foxes, otters, to name but a few, hope you find out as i dont know much about kites but wouldnt have thought they go around water , and marshes, rossy .

[wyvern1]

Fudgey,

I would confess to being more than sceptical about not only the rates of predation but also the species being predated.
Red Kites, as you are proabably aware, are carrion feeders primarily and, as such, rarely take live prey. They are best known, like most of the Kite family, for taking insects and the very smallest of mammals in the worst case scenario that they have little carrion to feed on.
They are, despite their size, very weak birds with very soft talons. I would suggest, paticularly considering the type of environment that Peregrines, Hobby's et al would be more likely suspects, along with otters etc.

[glsammy]

Anyone who's been the one of the Kite Feeding Farms such as Gigrin would find these claims hard to believe.
The Kites struggle to take dead cut to size meat off the ground, rarely if ever landing. I'm not at all sure they could manage to take live birds in any kind of numbers.

[Jim Ford]

Originally Posted by FUDGEY

Ive just recieved information regarding predation on many different types of waders chicks in my area.

Doesn't mean much to me unless I know where "my area" is!

Jim

[RKB]

Originally Posted by rossy

after watching halcyon river diares and seeing the otter eat nearly all 10 mallard chicks ,

We didn't though, did we. We saw an otter chasing them. And next day they were gone. We didn't actually see the otter kill any at all, this was only inferred. This is the kind of leap of faith that I suspect is being made in the OP.

[rossy]

no rkb we saw the otter actually chomping ,and one can only assume but what do you want to see the otter eating them off a plate ! charlie who filmed the footage witnessed the otter and it seems to me you in particular like to stir things up, not only on this thread but on other threads as well take a day off, rossy.

[nigel_b]

What's the difference between the original post #1 and

"I saw a mink there and now there's no chicks."

In practice there's no difference.