Pied wagtails-white wagtails

[pegasus]

This is probably a silly question but what is the difference between these two birds?

[wizzo]

Hi Pegasus! Not a silly question at all mate. The White Wagtail is the European equivelent of the Pied Wagtail. The Male White is much whiter with a more pronounced grey back also has a very obvious black breast band. Winter males have grey underparts. Back and rump are grey. Females are much harder to spot. Everything about the White and Pied Wagtails in terms of habitat, voice and behaviour is the same. Whites can be spotted on the west coast. I'm sure that other on here can give a more definitive answer, but hope this helps a little - Wizzo

[pegasus]

Cheers wizzo----I saw a Waggie a few months ago and thought it looked a bit different so it must a been a white one.
Thanks again.

[Harold Smith]

Hallo Pegasus,

I have had the same problem. Over the years I suspect I have seen many White Wagtails that I have assumed to be Pied.

A friend of mine gave me these two useful links on identification. I found the PDF file very helpful.

White Wagtail - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

http://www.thesoc.myzen.co.uk/docs/white-wagtail-id.pdf

Regards,

Harold.

[pegasus]

Thanks harold----Glad it is'nt only me who had problems!

[Adam Cheeseman]

White Wagtail Motacilla alba is the species found on the continent. Our Pied Wagtail Motacilla alba yarrellii is the British subspecies.
Winter males, females and young Pieds are all quite a bit iffy on occasions and the unwary can be caught unawares. You will normally only get Whites here on migration when they can occur in numbers, but they are far less frequent than most people think.

[david156]

Originally Posted by pegasus

Cheers wizzo----I saw a Waggie a few months ago and thought it looked a bit different so it must a been a white one.
Thanks again.

One thing to check out is juvinile pied wagtails. They do look a lot paler than adults and are often identified as white wagtails in error.

Cheers David.

[RoyW]

Originally Posted by Harold Smith

A friend of mine gave me these two useful links on identification. I found the PDF file very helpful.

White Wagtail - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

http://www.thesoc.myzen.co.uk/docs/white-wagtail-id.pdf

As a word of warning, the accuracy of the information in the pdf file has been questioned by some birders - and in any case, separation of 1st winter type birds in field views is going to be difficult if you do not have field experience of both races.



White Wagtails are regular passage migrants (mid March-May & late Aug-October or early November), but are only really safely identified in the spring unless you have studied the variation in both races in detail. This doesn't mean that they can't be identified during the autumn, but many observers are confused by young Pied Wagtails. The actual numbers that pass through Britain can vary, and they are far more likely to be seen near the south and east coasts.
The best features to look for on pale grey backed 'alba' wagtails (if you want to try and identify the subspecies) are the flanks and rump. The flanks on White wagtails are cleaner, with no (or very little) pale grey visible below the wings; flanks on Pied Wagtails have variable amounts of often quite dark grey visible below the wings. The rump, if you can manage to see it, is black in Pied Wagtails, but the same grey colour as the back in White Wagtails.

I see no reason why some White Wagtails shouldn't remain in Britain during the winter, but don't yet believe there is enough evidence to suggest this is regularly occuring (yet!).

[pegasus]

Thanks everyone----Clearly the issue of ID is more complicated that i thought[reassuringly so!]--