Should i stop feeding the birds in this situation ?

[ron1863]

Our neighbours have cats that used to hunt around our feeders, I just let my Yorkie out every so often and he soon scares them, they eventually got the message and we rarely see them now.

[Steve_In_Cheshire]

The little critter was in the usual spot at first light this morning, hid under a bush and waiting to pounce on the ground feeders like the chaffinches and dunnocks. As soon as i got anywhere near the hose it was off.

Has anyone got a lion spare that i can use for a week ? I`ll keep it well fed on some whiskas while its here, it may get a treat of a nice juicy cat as well.

[Madelinew]

Sorry Steve - I misunderstood your use of the term groundfeeders in your original post. I thought you meant you had a ground feeding table in use hence my recommendation that you get rid of it. I certainly don't mean get rid of your groundfeeding birds! I still recommend you try a way of breaking the cats stalking chances with a barrier of some kind whether it's a cheap bit of low level wire fencing or twine as has also been suggested. It does make a difference. Plus cats get in the habit of using certain bits of ground cover. If it's practical you could try trimming the bottom of the shrub your predator is using. Similar measures honestly made a big difference in my garden.

[Jim Ford]

Cat apologists are keeping their heads down so far. With a thread like this they soon leap in to attempt to defend the indefensible!

Jim

[Steve_In_Cheshire]

Ive taken someones advice above.

Ive positioned the bird table in the middle of the lawn and its a good 15 ft away from any boundary fencing and bushes, its no more open to an attack from our sparrowhawk but its well away from any of the little critters ambush spots in the bushes, hopefully if the birds do start to feed on the table and hanging feeders in its new position they will have plenty of time to see our resident sparrowhawk, they have some escape routes very near by into the trees.

Its not ideal but at least food is their if birds need it, ive stopped putting anything on the ground, the only food is in the bird table itself and in the hanging feeders which are quiter high up as its quite a tall bird table. I`ll just see how that goes for now.

[valleyforge]

Originally Posted by Jim Ford

Cat apologists are keeping their heads down so far. With a thread like this they soon leap in to attempt to defend the indefensible!

OK ... that sounds like an invitation then, for me to pull on the mantle of counsel for the defence.

First of all, let me state that I like cats no more or less than I like birds, but I do recognize that in a situation such as this (or in fact with any other human interaction with wildlife) conflict is rarely the path to a solution.

First of all let's examine why cats hunt birds ... well we all know that ... they are programmed to ... it's in their nature, they are only doing what they are designed to do.

Well that's true enough of course, but the need to hunt derives from:
a) the need to eat
b) the need for mental stimulation

Now it could be argued that the cat in Steve's garden that is there 'morning, noon and night' is more than likely not being cared for adequately by the irresponsible owners who let it wander ... so it's prime need therefore might indeed be to fill its stomach and survive.

A solution to that problem therefore might be ... feed the cat! Well-fed cats like nothing more than to sleep off a meal ... when they are sleeping, they don't bother birds or anything else ... unless they snore heavily.

So maybe the cat is getting '3 square meals a day' from its owner ... why else might it be hunting birds. Well, often mammals need essential minerals and amino acids that are lacking in the foodstuffs they are being fed, and they physically need to find a replacement for what their bodies are lacking ... for carnivores like cats an essential constituent of its diet must be taurine, which is included in most good quality cat foods, but not of course in table scraps.

Possible solution ... provide a high quality dry cat food enriched with taurine, or perhaps better one designed for obligate carnivores such as ferrets.

Next scenario ... even well fed cats will stalk birds. This is true, because an animal as intelligent as a cat needs a lot of mental stimulation, and the act of stalking can provide a lot of stimulation.

Being shouted at by irate birdwatchers, soaked with water jets, or overcoming obstacles around bird feeders, can however also perversely produce perhaps sufficient stimulation for some cats to keep returning to that location where such stimultation is guaranteed. So that's not necessarily a tactic that will work with all cats. Those sort of tactics are much more likely to raise your blood pressure and cause ulcers than they are to deter cats who have no concept of just why you might be so mad at them.

Possible solution ... temporarily remove the stimuli ... stop feeding the birds in a manner that presents them as a target for the cat, and change the feeding routine so that you only feed the birds AFTER you have fed the cat, at which point it will be much more interested in, and stimulated by, personal grooming and sleep than in hunting. Simples.

Counsel for the defence rests.

[Jim Ford]

Originally Posted by valleyforge

Counsel for the defence rests.

Case not proven - send them (the cats) down!
;^)

Jim

[valleyforge]

Originally Posted by Jim Ford

Case not proven - send them (the cats) down!

Damn ... didn't know we were up against Hanging Judge Jim.

[Steve_In_Cheshire]

valley forge

I have a relative that pampours their cat, they don`t feed birds btw as the garden isn`t large enough and its mainly concrete and flag stones.

They had a spell where the cat has been bringing back rabbits and birds from fields near by, this cat doesn`t go hungry, its the opposite as it gets all its daily meals + treats.

I accept that some owners don`t look after their cats the way they should and they probably go hungry and are forced to hunt, the area we live in is a fairly decent area, its not posh by any means but i wouldn`t expect anyone that lives round here wouldn`t feed their pet.

This cat that we have problems with is probably over spoilt and can get away with anything it wants, i wouldn`t mind guessing that its brought birds back to where it lives and its owners have gone "awwww look at you, catching the birdies" instead of telling the little critter off.

This cat is out at all hours so it will have access to a cat flap 24/7, in my opinion a cat owner should NOT let a cat have access to getting outside after a certain time, ive heard cats in the past fighting at 2am and another cat making that baby crying noise right under the bedroom window.

Cat owners should have certain responsibilities, like i said above i bet most go "awwww look at you" when a cat brings back some wildlife its killed because they don`t want to shout at what they think is their cute little puddy cat, they are killing machines if you let them get away with murder.

You see hardly any with bells on their collars either, i bet the majority of cats don`t have them as ive never heard jangle jangle once from a cat bell.

[valleyforge]

Originally Posted by Steve_In_Cheshire

This cat is out at all hours so it will have access to a cat flap 24/7, in my opinion a cat owner should NOT let a cat have access to getting outside after a certain time, ive heard cats in the past fighting at 2am and another cat making that baby crying noise right under the bedroom window.

You see hardly any with bells on their collars either, i bet the majority of cats don`t have them as ive never heard jangle jangle once from a cat bell.

Steve,

Actually I'm in agreement with you entirely ... the problem with domestic cats is wholly down to their owners being irresponsible. No domestic cat should be allowed to roam freely after dark, as much for its own safety, as for the safety of wildlife. Unfortunately, there seems to be an accepted myth with many cat owners that cats need to be put out at night ... that's not easily overcome though and typically it's the folk who can't really be bothered with cats who are most to blame, so attempts at educating them otherwise are generally pointless.

We run a wildlife refuge here and have 3 formally feral cats ... all are neutered and subject to a strict curfew that they accept happily as their daily routine.

The two male cats are allowed out only after 0900hrs and wander back by 1130hrs or 1200hrs ... sooner if it's raining heavily or windy. Thereafter, for the remainder of the day and night they are entirely content to be indoors.

The female cat has only 3 legs and so goes out for short sorties, only under supervision (and accompanied by her best pal, the dog).

Even so, all our cats wear collars with name tags and 3 bells ... as much so we can locate them as for wildlife protection.

Single cat bells are pretty ineffective, but with two or three bells, even the most cautious creeping of cats will jangle a sufficient warning for birds.

My point is only that we should try not to demonize the cat, when the fault lies squarely elsewhere ... essentially with irresponsible cat owners.