Lack of chicks ?

[m1.carson]

Hi,

I may be a little premature on this, but I walk two disused gravel pits every morning, and it seems that there are hardly any chicks at all.

There've been two ducks, one with two and one with one duckling, all three have gone, one pair of swans with three, now down to two goslings, moorhens, no chicks at all but three broken/eaten eggs on the bank, and nothing from the crested grebes.

I know there are a lot of foxes and Badgers in the area, and across the Thames further downstream are reports of Mink, but the birds don't seem to be producing the eggs, could it be something in the water, or the type of weather ?.

If it was the water, I would assume Thames water would have picked up on it.

Max.

[m1.carson]

Hi People,

Is the lack of chicks just in my patch then, the swans used to have about 6 in tow, ducks and moorhens about 8 and grebe usually about 2, which unfortunately was the quantity required for some of them to survive to be adults ?.

Anyone else noticed a decline ?.

Reading, Berks area.

Max.

[mrs fish]

I see that every year, first there are nine ducklings or five moorhen chicks and then they decrease day by day, I think there may be a variety of predators.

[Madz]

I've noticed something a little similar on two ponds near where I live, although to be fair there have been some very successful first broods with ducks, geese, coots and moorhens on one of the ponds. On the smaller pond however there was a lot of nesting activity with the moorhens about 6 weeks ago then absolutely nothing. On the larger pond there was similar nesting activity with the coots and moorhens about 3 weeks ago where I anticipated second broods but again all activity ie nest-sitting has stopped. Don't know why this happens. Especially wondered why the unsuccesful moorhens on the small pond didn't try again if the first clutch failed for whatever reason.

Madz

[JeffH]

It's true that the mortality rates of fledgling birds are quite staggering. Water birds such as ducklings and Moorhen chicks can be subject to predation by Pike and, in particular, by Herons. Last year, on a large farm pond about 50 metres from my garden, a whole clutch of ducklings were taken by Herons within a matter of days.

Similarly, last weekend's spell of very wet (and fairly cold) weather will no doubt have resulted in the demise of many thousands of young birds - in our own garden we found a dead juvenile Robin (it was totally drenched) and also saw some very bedraggled looking baby Blue Tits.

In addition, nature's own in-built population control mechanisms play a part - for instance, in the case of Kingfishers it is estimated that less than 50% of fledglings survive for more than 2 weeks after being driven out of the nesting territory by their parents only a few days after leaving the nest and due to many of them simply failing to master the necessary fishing skills during those few days of 'training' by the parent birds.

But it's not all doom and gloom - whilst out Kingfisher watching this morning I took this shot of a mummy Mallard with her chicks and with the brood still seeming to be fairly intact

Jeff

[mrs fish]

Your brood looks intact because it is only a day or two old

I was going to ask about pike eating water chicks, I think that is why the chicks are disappearing on the canal, I have seen a heron only once in nine years!
Would a sparrowhawk take prey of the water/duck weed?

I took this pic and it is what made me think of pike

[jennyb]

I didn't realise that herons will take chicks. We have a heron visit our pond every day. I am not so worried about the fish - a lot of them are big enough to look after themselves, but I would be very angry if I thought the heron was taking chicks.

We have a moorhen that nests at our pond every year. We usually see some chicks. However, this year, in spite of seeing 7 eggs in the nest a few weeks ago, they all disappeared with no sign of any chicks. Yesterday, I noticed that she has started again and there are 2 eggs in a new nest. I hope she has some success this time.

Jenny

[JeffH]

[quote=mrs fish;125567]Your brood looks intact because it is only a day or two old

I was going to ask about pike eating water chicks, I think that is why the chicks are disappearing on the canal, I have seen a heron only once in nine years!
Would a sparrowhawk take prey of the water/duck weed?

I took this pic and it is what made me think of pike [quote]

Yes, I've actually seen a pike snap up a duckling from the surface and have also seen a Heron snatch the last chick of a row of ducklings as they swam by in a line behind mother.

The latter was at Minsmere many years ago when I was in one of the large hides with a friend , several other birders and a group of 'ladies of a certain age 'who looked like they might have been a WI coach party (not that there's anything wrong with the WI of course ) or something similar.

The Heron was hunting by the edge of the mere in front of the hide and had made several unsuccessful stabs into the water without catching anything. As the ducklings swam by the Heron must have decided to go for an easier option and simply grabbed the last of the chicks at which point the 'WI' ladies started shouting and screaming and even banging on the side of the hide in disgust and anger at this cruel act of nature

Needless to say, almost every bird on the mere took off at the noise - as did the Heron, still with the chick in its bill - and as did we birders We then avoided the 'WI' ladies for the rest of the day

Incidentally, I've also seen Herons trying to get chicks from Rooks nests!

As for Sparrowhawks taking water-based chicks, I can't say I've ever seen this myself but I wouldn't be at all surprised.

Finally, the brood of ducklings shown in my photo is actually a little older than you suggest - I first saw them on the water early on Wednesday morning and they must therefore have been at least 4 days old by the time I took the photo yesterday morning. I saw them all again this morning - still in a group of 9

Jeff

[Madz]

Originally Posted by JeffH

The latter was at Minsmere many years ago when I was in one of the large hides with a friend , several other birders and a group of 'ladies of a certain age 'who looked like they might have been a WI coach party (not that there's anything wrong with the WI of course ) or something similar.

The Heron was hunting by the edge of the mere in front of the hide and had made several unsuccessful stabs into the water without catching anything. As the ducklings swam by the Heron must have decided to go for an easier option and simply grabbed the last of the chicks at which point the 'WI' ladies started shouting and screaming and even banging on the side of the hide in disgust and anger at this cruel act of nature

Jeff

Sometimes the behaviour of the birdwatchers is almost as interesting as the birds themselves. This flock of post-breeding females would still have strong maternal and now matriarchal instincts, thus giving such an aggressive display!!!!!

Madz

[m1.carson]

Hi,

Perhaps I've worded this post incorrectly, it's the lack of eggs/hatchlings I noticed, pre-predators, but the photo's show at least it's not happening country-wide, thank goodness.

Perhaps I'm just scaremongering

Max.

[ctabuk]

Originally Posted by jennyb

I didn't realise that herons will take chicks. We have a heron visit our pond every day. I am not so worried about the fish - a lot of them are big enough to look after themselves, but I would be very angry if I thought the heron was taking chicks.

We have a moorhen that nests at our pond every year. We usually see some chicks. However, this year, in spite of seeing 7 eggs in the nest a few weeks ago, they all disappeared with no sign of any chicks. Yesterday, I noticed that she has started again and there are 2 eggs in a new nest. I hope she has some success this time.

Jenny

Herons will take on most things including chicks, frogs, mice, - if you have a pond do not put in any shelves. Make it more than 3 feet deep - any way to stop them wading, or spearing from a range of about two feet.

There are also fairly large numbers of Coypu being seen. These will deplete numbers of ducks/moorhens - River Authorities will investigate. Tell tale sign of Coypu is a hole in a bank or dyke, normally about two/three feet from the top - with a 'slide' run underneath the hole.

[mrs fish]

Well I never, I have just seen my second heron flying over the NR in 9 years, now perhaps that is why the chicks are disappearing.

How far would a heron fly from its herony/nest (if it has one) to get food?

[JeffH]

Originally Posted by mrs fish

How far would a heron fly from its herony/nest (if it has one) to get food?

Our nearest Heronry is approx 7 miles away but I see/hear them almost daily as they visit a farm pond in the meadow adjacent to our garden.

Jeff

[mrs fish]

Seven miles, blimey.
I can't believe I saw a heron yesterday after only seeing one in nine years, he flew over me and disappeared into the reed bed, quite a treat for me

[ctabuk]

Herons will travel far more than seven miles. Heronaries consist of up to 100 nests. The latest RSPB figures show 13,000 mating couples in the United Kingdom. They divide into 'flying zones' and will set off at dawn on a circular flight path. If they find rich pickings in one location - say eels in the Witham then they will sit patiently for hours. They can go days and days without food. But if push comes to shove then they will at dawn go after baby Rabbits on river banks.
Also it pays to know that if your fish stock in your ponds deplete, it may not be the heron who is the guilty party. Mallards eat goldfish, so it pays to have a deep pond. Ours is nearly six feet deep!

[Urisk]

Well, at my work the swans have been fairly successful, but so far the little grebes have yet to hatch their eggs (if they even have any). Mind you, one of the swans have been acting odd. I've had people comping up to me concerned about the distinct lack of movement of the mother from the nest, but when I go out there doesn't seem to be any problem; she's out on the water with her babies, and all 7 cygnets are healthy. And yet people are still commenting on how she doesn't seem to leave the nest. So she seems to be alternately going out on the loch and coming back in to the nest to remain there almost stationary for some time. Like I say when I check on her, she seems fine. Maybe she's toying with us all...

[Demoiselle]

Hi. I saw it recently on an episode of 'Birding with Bill Oddie' That sometimes, if Coots have produced a large brood, after a while they seem to get bored with having to feed so many and go into a process of reducing their numbers by whatever means necessary. This can mean either chasing away or even killing their own chicks. Seems a bit harsh. But they did show it happening.